I don't get to my puter as much these days because I'm back to work. I would be out of town now but there is a blizzard west of here with poor visibility so we like to stay off the highways at that time. People seem to have enough trouble seeing us working on the highway when it is clear much less when it's snowing and blowing.

Oh I see 1895, well enjoy work. Money is good

Dimitri

Yep the money is good and I really like my job. You see I work 7 - 8 months then I'm off work for 4 - 5 months.

What is happening in the southern USA is what I call a "Passive Invasion". The "invaders" don't quite break the law, but they bend it badly and tie it in knots. They hope to win the favour of the "bleeding heart, do-gooder, tree hugger, gay rights, rent a crowd, minority groups" who will support them, in the name of humanity, in their illegal passive invasion.

Flying the flag of their old country ABOVE the flag of their new home is treason! There is nothing wrong with being proud of their heritage, but it must be shown tastefully and with respect for their new society.

Immigrants that move to a country MUST be prepared to adopt the culture, language and laws of that country. In the majority of cases they have fled oppression in their parent country. All too often this oppression is from religious groups....look at the Taliban. Once they settle into their new country they then start jumping up and down, making a big noise and try to bring their old culture, including the problems with it, to their new home.

There is a group of "immigrants" (and I use that term loosely) who have different reasons for being in Australia. One part of this ethnic group are here because they are escaping problems in their old country and they have intergrated well into Australian society. The other part of this group are here solely as a "stepping stone" to other things. As soon as the problems have eased in their old country they plan on going back. In the meantime they are causing all sorts of nasty problems for us. They have set up their own community with their own ideals, morals, religion and culture....all from their "old" country. They do not accept or agree with ours. The worst part is they have no respect for women. But, there appears to be little we can do about it because they scream discrimination if anybody comes out against them or their ideals. We did manage to jail 4 or 5 of them for about 50 years apiece for raping an Australian girl. Of course they called foul and claimed discrimination.

Immigrants.....I have nothing against them, hell, I am a mixture of Irish and Scottish. They bring some magnificent things with them, like food ideas (YUM) and work ethics. Some of my friends are of ethnic extraction and they are damn fine people.

However, when they try to turn their new home into the same hell as their old, I say:

YOU HAVE ALL THE RIGHTS OF ALL CITIZENS OF THIS COUNTRY......
ONE OF THEN IS THE RIGHT TO LEAVE !!!

Allow me to show you the door. Watch your fingers on the way out as I slam the door behind you !!!



Cheers, Vince

Y'know, according to our constitution the country has no rights - its people do! This country is given the power to protect the rights of people by those who live here. Every person on American soil has the same GOD GIVEN rights as every other individual on our soil.
That may not be a very popular thing today but it is the stuff that our country was built on. People give the government power to protect the rights that God gave us all - not just Americans but all people. Some of us are so used to the government "taking care of us" that they don't realize that we are losing the rights that we are not supposed to be able to lose.
They're passing laws yhat limit free speach, they are taking our guns away. They are searching homes, vehicles, people and businesses without warrents and seizing property with no court procedings at all.
I guess most people think it is just the price you pay to be safe in a world where drugs and terrorism are "taking over". I think we are just too soft and lazy to get off our assets and stand up to those we have given too much power to and say, "We, the people, of the United States of America, are not going to give up our rights so be safe - We don't need to be "taken care of" - we can do that ourselves. Our fathers did, and their fathers and the fathers before them. We say ENOUGH! we have rights and we will fight with our votes, our money, and our very lives to keep them for our children just as our fathers and their fathers did for us."

But I don't think most of the citizens would get off their couches and walk to the phone to make a phone call to their representative and senator to secure their rights much less give up any monetary substance to do so. I think our founding fathers would disown us if they saw what we put up with today.

I just don't get it. These folks are illegal! Just enforce the law! Our sherriff here in Arizona is doing it, why can't all the other law makers nforce the law as well. This is getting out of hand. I'm not opposed to immigration as long as it's done through legal channels. The other day when they trashed our national anthem just goes to show you how much respect they have for our great country. It's time to take a stand, & I say show no quarter to what's illegal!!!
Keep it coming...

PaulS, God has given us the persons we are. God has, in this country, given the responsibility of governing, making laws, etc, to our US government. That government set up laws to be sure we live in some order. That includes laws governing the number of people who can visit, work, etc. in this country. God did not give everyone who is standing on US soil the right to break our laws, disregard our governments attemp at order within our borders. They are illegal and need to be treated as such. Our government is failing in it's responsibility to uphold the laws it generated.

Squirrelbait,

God gives all people rights - that was the message that our founding fathers placed in the Constitution. Only the people have rights. Those people give the government its power to establish laws and protect their rights.
God did not give our government any responsibility for anything - that was us.
Those people who are in this country illegally have broken the law to be here. I do not agree with the free ride to citizenship that the administration is offering and if it was in my power I would send them packing. I think we need tighter controls on our borders - all our borders not just the one to the south. We need more control not just to stop the poor from Mexico coming here to have kids (which makes the children US Citizens) but also to stop the drugs, auto theft, and trafficing in human lives. I do think that illegals should be stopped from entering our country. I also know that most of them are performing jobs that no family man could afford to do for the money they make. I don't know who will do those jobs and I really don't care - maybe our kids will do them - maybe those who are in the practice of hiring illegals will have to pay more to get those jobs done and we, the consumers, will have to pay the higher price for the goods and services as a result.
That isn't going to happen. The Mexican illegals are probably going to be made citizens so that they will have to pay taxes - the government wants the money more than they want to enforce the laws.
I don't see any reason to hate the illegals for taking advantage of our greedy government and becoming citizens if they can.

PaulS, we are on the same page. Please let's go back to my May 02 reply and realize that that was NOT what I would want to do......it makes office talk lively. I don't hate the illegals or anyone. You have it right, they are allowed to be here because of greed........at many levels.
We need to turn the spicet off (close the borders), or stop the bleeding, however you want to look at it. But you can't repair the wound until the bleeding stops.
"God did not give our government any responsibility for anything - that was us." I believe this is what I said. What I did not say and should have for clarification is that, yes, we the people ARE the Government by the fact that we elect those that would represent us and make polocies and laws based on that representation. I would submit that this process is also broken because of the politics and, again, greed.

You guys want to be careful with what you think and how you express it. The guy who started this thread has not been seen since - throw petrol on the fire and run seems to be his tactic. Beware - Freedom at the end of a gun is not going to last. Never has done, never will.

Whilst I agree with you all, there's no point in getting angry about stuff, always better to do something instead.

And before you even think about it, our government has just released from jail 1023 men who should have been deported. 1023! That's a cock up if ever I saw one. We get race riots and the country is going to the dogs. One of those released went on to shoot a police officer dead and he is still on the run.

All the powers that be want to do is blame each other and make political gains out of it. But even so, there's not point in ranting about it - it changes nothing. And forcing behaviour at the end of a gun won't work - just ask Pohl Pot.

D

Would like to make one thing CLEAR:

Immigrent: One who enters a country legally with the intentions of becoming a citizen of that country.

Illegal alien: One who enters a country illegally without permission of that government or its people. Note: These people demand equal rights and show disrespect of that countries people. THEY ARE CRIMINALS and don't deserve equal rights except what is deservent of a criminal. GOD did not say to break the laws of the land. The religious aspects of this will not fly.

I came close to deleting this thread when it first started because I know its an EXTREMELY heated issue for people on both sides of the fence. Yes it appear the initial poster was a troll who only posted it to make waves.

Anyway I've followed the thread and while its readily apparent people have extremely opinionated views on the subject, the discussion has remained fairly civil, kudo's to you guys for keeping it so.

This is a discussion I am also very opinionated about but dont have the desire to debate it yet again LOL. I think bushmasters last comment on the definitions sums up my feelings perfectly.


-DallanC

DallanC, Bushmaster seems to always have a way of making things pretty easy to see. I'm with ya.

Dallan,

Actually I was wondering when one of these would start. Seems like most firearm forms have a few of these threads ongoing for the last month or so at any given time.

Anyways I'm with Bushmasters definitions.

I think from some of the news artical's I have read our new Federal goverment is actually deporting people that they find as illegal immergrants about a month ago I think it was I was reading in the newspapers that they started.

Dimitri

Bushy

I'm with you too. we've got a country full of people over here who have entered illegally. tell you a story. When I was younger, I went for a government grant for business start up's. I was about 25 years old. I was told politely that nothing was available. No courses, grants, advice, mentoring - nothing. When I pressed the question 'why?' the bloke said, in a lowered voice, "Because you're white, educated, in good health and middle class". That means that I've been to school and work for a living. the colour thing I can't do anything about - I was born that way.

In other words, because I wasn't a welsh lesbian multiple amputee single mum, living on welfare, addicted to drugs with a criminal record, who had entered the country illegally and had learning difficulties, there was no help/support for me. Nada. If I was any of those catagories - and the more the better - the the cheque book would have come out and and have been paid to sit on my ass. All I would have to do is complain. A lot.

I think that it was about then that my beliefs of this country (UK) changed. It's not the fact that the country is filling up with those that should really be somewhere else it's the fact that the Government is doing diddly squat about it. In fact, dare I go as far to say that this is being organised? That it's being positively allowed? Don't ask me 'why' but if it really mattered, wouldn't the people that we elected be doing something about it?

England is one of the most racist countries that you'll ever see. Unfortunately, we are against ourselves whilst giving everything to those that do nought.

However, rule of the gun is, IMHO, not the way to go. remember that I have served in the Army too, I shoot, drink, ride motorbikes and generally don't fit the mould of normality. I just don't want another charge of the Light Brigade.

Daveyboy