Well I'm going to chime in for the FAL:

Cheaper than the other options

Plentiful supply of magazines from $6 up.

Simple to field strip without tools & easy to clean.
The FAL isn't finicky about cleaning - I have personally seen one that hasn't been cleaned in 14,000 rounds & still shoots 2.5MOA groups. The barrel has shot in excess of 20,000 rounds.

Adjustable gas system means it will operate reliably with a very wide range of ammunition in extremes of temperature.

A correctly assembled & maintained FAL is NOT inaccurate, with 2MOA being easily attained &1MOA possible with minor modifications & sometimes without.
The sights are simple to use & adjust.

Secure mounting of optics is achieved by replacing the steel top cover with a DSA, or other aftermarket, railed aluminium cover. This allows scopes or other optics to placed in the most advantageous position - the Eotech HWS is great on the FAL.

Plenty of aftermarket accessories, from free float handguards to complete sets of walnut furniture.

If you want something compact then the Paratrooper FAL with folding stock & 18" barrel is ideal. Oddly enough, these are often amongst the most accurate - the one I use is better than an L1A1 I also shoot.

Did I say I'm a FAL addict?

Dimitri wrote:

What type of aftermarket parts you looking for ?? Unlike the AR series of rifles there isn't a whole lot to add onto the gun but if you mention the type of things your looking for I can point you in the right direction. Dimitri

Folding/collapsible pistol grip stock, sight and scope mounts (I want to be able to put a really good quality scope on it like a Leupold VXIII,) extra mags and replacement parts, recommended armorers. I am beginning to consider the AR10 type. My brother, a retired Scount and Armored Cav guy won't shut up about his M4 so I may have to rethink this a little.

I know these may sound like dumb questions to those of you familiar with the FAL but if I get an FAL with the standard stock can I replace it with the folding Para type stock? Is the Para type just another FAL with a shorter barrel and a folding stock? Are the SA-58 rifles built by DSA better quality (or worse) than the STG-58 Austrian ones they sell? What's the difference between the type 1 and 2 receivers (is that the metric/inch magazine difference) and is one preferable over the other for any reason?

I guess in short, I'm looking for a nickel's worth of education in FAL rifles. Maybe I should just buy a damned book about them and read it but I'm kind of in a hurry to buy one and I don't want to wait. There's s surprising time delay in getting things up here at the end of the world. Maybe some of you could point me to some websites with good info on the guns? Thanks.

alaskanativeson wrote:

Folding/collapsible pistol grip stock, sight and scope mounts (I want to be able to put a really good quality scope on it like a Leupold VXIII,) extra mags and replacement parts, recommended armorers. I am beginning to consider the AR10 type. My brother, a retired Scount and Armored Cav guy won't shut up about his M4 so I may have to rethink this a little.

Folding stocks.

Troy Industries Mod-Stock - compatable with AR stocks & handgrips
www.troyind.com/m14MCSpage.html

McMillan Stock - AR compatable stocks.
www.mcmfamily.com/mcmi....php#mfs14

Scope Mounts.

Sadlak - Improved 3 point design.

sadlak.com/si_rifle_parts_sm.html

Basset Machine - Easy to install single point mount and with loads of good reviews (I'm going to be purchasing one of these myself).

www.bassettmachine.com/

Extra Magazines.

44Mag - Has the best prices around on NEW USGI magazines.

www.44mag.com

Spare Parts.

E-Gun Parts.

e-gunparts.com/product...l=2070zM14

Also best to look at gun shows and the like for USGI parts, but other then replacement guts for your M1A you shouldn't need anything more in your life time anyways. And if something does go wrong and its a warranty issue, SAI warranties their firearms for the lifetime of the original owner!

Dimitri

Thanks for all the input. Screw it, I'm going to pony up the money and get a DSA FAL. I'll probably get the dura-coat camo in ACU, desert camo, or underbrush. When I decide I'll post pics.

alaskanativeson wrote:

I know these may sound like dumb questions to those of you familiar with the FAL but if I get an FAL with the standard stock can I replace it with the folding Para type stock? Is the Para type just another FAL with a shorter barrel and a folding stock? Are the SA-58 rifles built by DSA better quality (or worse) than the STG-58 Austrian ones they sell? What's the difference between the type 1 and 2 receivers (is that the metric/inch magazine difference) and is one preferable over the other for any reason? I guess in short, I'm looking for a nickel's worth of education in FAL rifles. Maybe I should just buy a damned book about them and read it but I'm kind of in a hurry to buy one and I don't want to wait. There's s surprising time delay in getting things up here at the end of the world. Maybe some of you could point me to some websites with good info on the guns? Thanks.

The folding stock uses a different lower receiver, top cover, bolt carrier & recoil spring.
If you have both a standard & a Para lower, then changing from one to the other takes a couple of minutes.
Type1 & 2 receivers have different lightening cuts, Type 3 are more slab sided.
Metric & Inch receivers have different mag well cutouts.

The DSA StG 58 is no longer available new.

For THE most complete knowledge of all things FAL join the FAL Files (OK, so I'm a moderator there & I'm biased ).

No doubt in my mind that I'd get the M1. For hunting, target, plinking it is a working rifle, not a gun store-Rambo toy.

I have shot the 91 and had an M1A and the FAL and it was my favorite just my two cents....

wncchester wrote:

No doubt in my mind that I'd get the M1. For hunting, target, plinking it is a working rifle, not a gun store-Rambo toy.

The differences between the M1A, FAL & HK91 are a matter of looks, ergonomics & operating mechanisms.

None of them are a "gun store-Rambo toy" & all three are perfectly capable of being used for the tasks you mention.

I have a question for you guys. How many of you have shot all four guns in the field, in competition or on a range? If you have shot all four guns I would be interested in your ranking of 1-4 and why.

AR-10
FNFAL
H&K
M1A

Ed

SwampFox wrote:

I have a question for you guys. How many of you have shot all four guns in the field, in competition or on a range? If you have shot all four guns I would be interested in your ranking of 1-4 and why. AR-10 FNFAL H&K M1A Ed

I haven't shot the HK but I have the other three.

Bear in mind that I'm left handed.

AR10 has good ergonomics but I couldn't get on with the sights & the cocking lever. Ejected brass occasionally hit my head.
Cleaning is a pain.

M1A has the best sights but the "traditional" stock slows down handling where fire & movement mean the rifle isn't constantly shouldered. Gives me wrist ache too because of the angle.

The FAL has good ergonomics & just plain fits me - cheek weld is intuitive & the sights are OK but nothing special. Flip sights on the Para are better where targets are a mix of close up & medium distance.
Using an Eotech on the FAL, combined with the pistol grip configuration makes it REALLY fast handling.
Cleaning is by far the easiest out of the three - break it open, extract the bolt & carrier, remove the gas plug & piston & everything is easy to get at.

If operation in arctic weather is a criteria, of the three rifles you mentioned, you have to go with the HK. THe G-3/HK-91 is recoil operated. Gas operated autoloaders are not near as reliable as recoil operated autoloaders in cold weather.

As much as I love FALs, I have seen them fail to extract in -20F weather.

Well, I got a DSA kit, I have a type 2 receiver on order from DSA that should get here later this month, and I'm going to have someone assemble it when I get down the The World when school lets out. When I get it together, I'll post pics.

I also picked up a DPMS Panther in .243 because it was a great deal. The guy I bought it from is about 10 miles away from my father-in-law so they met and now the gun is waiting for me in his closet. One of the things that made me decide to try the AR type is that all I need is a new upper assembly and I have a whole new rifle in a different caliber. I'm planning to get a .308, but I'm even more excited to find a place that'll custom bulid an upper for me in any caliber that the action'll fit. I'm going to get a 7mm-08, but the one that REALLY excited me is a .450 Marlin. THAT should be a real thumper of a gun! (When I get down there I'll post pics of that, too.)

I didn't realize they were putting in 450 Marlins (ie "improved" 45-70's) into AR-10 style of firearms thats pretty neat.

If you got a AR-15, the 50 Beowolf is effectively balistically the same as the 45-70, so the 450 Marlin guns will pack more "punch" then the "short" action AR's in the Beowolf. Still it was mighty impressive when I saw a magazine artical on it.

Dimitri