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tlo7mm Super Member
Joined: Nov 15, 2010 Posts: 426 Location: Oregon
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Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 12:22 am Post subject: Test loads? |
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I have to get everyones openion on this subject since I would like to be as realistic and productive in my reloading as I can be. When I started reloading it was with my brother at his place and I learned a fair amount from him and have filled in the gaps with stuff I have learned along the way including the information I have picked up on this great forum. He had me do a work up of test loads for my big 7. what we did was start with the max suggested load for the bullet and powder combo that we started with and loaded 5 rounds with that load and then the next we stepped down half a grain from max and loaded 5 rounds. Then we proceeded to do the same in 5 shot incraments reducing the loads half a grain until we had 20 rounds made up with the powder/bullet combination. What I am curiuos about is weather or not this is a good formula to determine which load shoots best in my gun or should I do things differently? I would like everyones openion on the subject.
I ask because the first rounds I loaded where speer 160gr spitzers backed with 62 grains of H4831SC over an alcan maxfire LR primer. I then stepped down to 61.5 grains then to 61 grains and finally 60.5 grains. All three rounds were quite accurate and shot pretty much the same. I was wondering if I needed to step up to a whole grains difference or if I just need to pick a single charge and try that.
_________________ "If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun." ~ The Dalai Lama
Never ascribe to malice that which is adequately explained by incompetence. - Napoleon Bonaparte
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Vince Site Admin
Joined: May 25, 2005 Posts: 15725 Location: Brisbane AUSTRALIA
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Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 1:13 am Post subject: Re: Test loads? |
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What I would do (and did) was have a read of the OCW Article on the front page of The Nut, then applied that principle to working up a load. Nothing hard about it mate, and it actually works. I think .5 grain increments are maybe a little too big and you will skip past that sweet spot in the load without realising it...but see what the OCW system does for you.
www.huntingnut.com/ind...cle&sid=17
Give it a try...nothing to loose and everything to gain mate.
Cheers, Vince
_________________ Cheers, Vince
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dhc4ever Super Member
Joined: May 26, 2011 Posts: 2944 Location: Ipswich, Queensland Australia
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Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 1:18 am Post subject: Re: Test loads? |
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My only comment would be, you have the process correct but in reverse.
Start shooting the lower powered loads FIRST, and work your way up in power, checking for signs of excessive pressure.
Once you find the one that groups best you can fine tune around it with variations in .1 of a grain and see if that makes a noticeable difference.
You can also vary your bullet seating depth and see how that effects things.
Cheers
_________________ Pete
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Ominivision1 Super Member
Joined: Sep 20, 2010 Posts: 2984 Location: Iowa
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Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 3:22 am Post subject: Re: Test loads? |
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Always start with the minimum start load and work your way up. Internal case capacities vary enough between different brass makers to have an undesirable affect especially when using fast burning powder, different powder lots. Again, start low and watch for pressure signs, carbon blow by around primer, shell hard to extract after firing, etc.
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Last edited by Ominivision1 on Wed Aug 24, 2011 10:01 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Vince Site Admin
Joined: May 25, 2005 Posts: 15725 Location: Brisbane AUSTRALIA
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tlo7mm Super Member
Joined: Nov 15, 2010 Posts: 426 Location: Oregon
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Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 8:57 am Post subject: Re: Test loads? |
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That makes since. Thanks for the info. I am still new at this so I am still learning the ins and outs of reloading. My brother learned from his Father-in-law which likes to load all his ammo hot so thats why I wanted to ask about this.
_________________ "If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun." ~ The Dalai Lama
Never ascribe to malice that which is adequately explained by incompetence. - Napoleon Bonaparte
The wisdom of man never yet contrived a system of taxation that would operate with perfect equality. - Andrew Jackson
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it. - Mark Twain |
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Elvis Super Member
Joined: Jul 27, 2008 Posts: 9261 Location: south island New Zealand
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Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 12:52 pm Post subject: Re: Test loads? |
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most manuals say start 5-10 % below max and work slowly up. when you find the best play with primers ,seating depth etc to try to find that super duper load. often the most accurate load is not the hottest sometimes by a suprising amount.none of my loads are too hot anymore, been there done that, dont need it dont want it. give me a nice accurate load that has enough oumph to do the job any day.
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Aloysius Super Member
Joined: Nov 03, 2009 Posts: 2440 Location: B., Belgium
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Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 1:10 pm Post subject: Re: Test loads? |
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...if not: take a bigger caliber!
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English Mike Super Member
Joined: Jan 08, 2007 Posts: 1709 Location: Whitehaven, Cumbria, UK
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Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 2:12 pm Post subject: Re: Test loads? |
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Buy a copy of the Lyman 49th Edition Reloading Handbook - it's far more than just a list of loads for each caliber & explains the hows & whys of reloading clearly & in detail.
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Pumpkinslinger Super Member
Joined: Sep 22, 2007 Posts: 5002 Location: NC foothills
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Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 5:27 pm Post subject: Re: Test loads? |
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Ditto what the guys above said! For testing loads I made an Excel spread sheet. I enter the max and start loads and it calculates the loads in between to give me starting points. I use 1% increments. For example, if the max load is 26.0 I get charge weights of 26.0, 25.7, 25.5, 25.2, 25.0 and 24.7. The irregular steps are due to rounding the numbers. I load three rounds of each charge weight, except the lowest which is loaded five times. Total of 20 rounds. I print the Excel file on an index card for use at the range. It includes the load info as well as places to record the velocities and group sizes for each load.
When testing I fire two "foulers" with the lowest load to make sure I'm on the paper. Then I start shooting three shot groups, starting with the lowest load. One or two loads should be smaller than the rest and then you can start tweaking from there.
_________________ Mike
"I ain't no better than anybody else, and there ain't nobody better than me!" Ma Kettle |
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fnuser Super Member
Joined: Dec 23, 2008 Posts: 914 Location: S.W. Missouri, U.S.A.
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Posted: Thu Aug 25, 2011 6:31 am Post subject: Re: Test loads? |
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I agree, but let me add it sounds like your loads are the right length if all were accurate. some times even if you find a decent load you still have to chase the right seating depth, it sounds like you got lucky and found it the first crank.
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44marty Super Member
Joined: Mar 20, 2009 Posts: 775 Location: Cheshire, MA; USA
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Posted: Tue Aug 30, 2011 5:31 pm Post subject: Re: Test loads? |
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Ominivision1 wrote: |
Always start with the minimum start load and work your way up. Internal case capacities vary enough between different brass makers to have an undesirable affect especially when using fast burning powder, different powder lots. Again, start low and watch for pressure signs, carbon blow by around primer, shell hard to extract after firing, etc. |
This is a good description of the process. As far as the difference between powder charges, subtract the minimum from the maximum powder charge in the reloading manual and divide by 5 to get the size step to use between charge weights. A .5 gr difference between charges is too small for large cases like the .300 magnums and too large for cartridges like the .38 special.
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stovepipe Super Member
Joined: Sep 25, 2008 Posts: 4877 Location: Pine, Az.
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Posted: Wed Aug 31, 2011 2:27 pm Post subject: Re: Test loads? |
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Ominivision1 wrote: |
Always start with the minimum start load and work your way up. Internal case capacities vary enough between different brass makers to have an undesirable affect especially when using fast burning powder, different powder lots. . |
Bazingo! Always use published info from a reliable manual. Always use the START recipe. Loading to MAX rarely does anything other than wear out firearms and brass. I use the least amount of ooomph to get the group I want while still maintaing bullet performance. Why? cuz we have to use non-canister propellents! It's ususally somewhere in the middle of the charge weights. MAX is for speed junkies and I see no need for same if you shoot on a regular basis, neither will the bullet!
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tlo7mm Super Member
Joined: Nov 15, 2010 Posts: 426 Location: Oregon
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Posted: Thu Sep 01, 2011 7:24 pm Post subject: Re: Test loads? |
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Hey thanks for the info. I was thinking that max was a waste of my time but I thought I would get everyones openion on the subject.
_________________ "If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun." ~ The Dalai Lama
Never ascribe to malice that which is adequately explained by incompetence. - Napoleon Bonaparte
The wisdom of man never yet contrived a system of taxation that would operate with perfect equality. - Andrew Jackson
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it. - Mark Twain |
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RePete Super Member
Joined: Aug 15, 2005 Posts: 1035 Location: Gods Country
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Posted: Fri Sep 02, 2011 5:12 am Post subject: Re: Test loads? |
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I find that if you look at the tables, see where the max velocity for the components combination is, and start 2 velocities lower.
Increase by .2gr. Load 5 of each.
I've also found that the second highest, listed velocity (assume 2700fps is max, then 2600fps) is generally the most accurate.
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