HuntingNut
HuntingNut
   Login or Register
HomeCommunity ForumsPhoto AlbumsRegister
     
 

User Info

Welcome Anonymous


Membership:
Latest: deathloads
New Today: 1
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 13139

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 330
BOT: 1
Total: 331
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Forums
02: Forums
03: Forums
04: Forums
05: Forums
06: Forums
07: Forums
08: Photo Albums
09: Home
10: Photo Albums
11: Forums
12: Your Account
13: Home
14: Forums
15: Photo Albums
16: Forums
17: Forums
18: Home
19: Home
20: Forums
21: Forums
22: Forums
23: Forums
24: Forums
25: Home
26: Forums
27: Photo Albums
28: Forums
29: Home
30: Forums
31: Forums
32: Forums
33: Home
34: Home
35: Forums
36: Forums
37: Forums
38: Photo Albums
39: Forums
40: Home
41: Home
42: Forums
43: Forums
44: Home
45: Home
46: Forums
47: Home
48: Home
49: Forums
50: Forums
51: Home
52: Forums
53: Home
54: Home
55: Forums
56: Photo Albums
57: Forums
58: Home
59: Your Account
60: Forums
61: Forums
62: Home
63: Forums
64: Forums
65: Home
66: Forums
67: Forums
68: Home
69: Home
70: Forums
71: Forums
72: Forums
73: Forums
74: Home
75: Home
76: Forums
77: News
78: Forums
79: Forums
80: Forums
81: Forums
82: Home
83: Home
84: Home
85: Home
86: Forums
87: Forums
88: Forums
89: Forums
90: Home
91: Home
92: Forums
93: Forums
94: Photo Albums
95: Statistics
96: Home
97: Forums
98: Home
99: Photo Albums
100: Forums
101: Home
102: Home
103: Forums
104: Forums
105: News
106: Home
107: Forums
108: News
109: Forums
110: Home
111: Forums
112: Forums
113: Home
114: Forums
115: Forums
116: Forums
117: Forums
118: Home
119: Forums
120: News
121: Forums
122: Forums
123: Home
124: Home
125: Forums
126: Home
127: Home
128: Forums
129: Home
130: Forums
131: Home
132: Forums
133: Forums
134: Home
135: Home
136: Photo Albums
137: Home
138: Forums
139: Forums
140: Forums
141: Home
142: Forums
143: Home
144: Home
145: Forums
146: Forums
147: Forums
148: Forums
149: Home
150: Forums
151: Forums
152: Home
153: Forums
154: Home
155: Forums
156: Forums
157: Forums
158: Forums
159: Home
160: Forums
161: Forums
162: Forums
163: Forums
164: Your Account
165: Forums
166: Forums
167: Forums
168: Home
169: Forums
170: Forums
171: Forums
172: Forums
173: Forums
174: Forums
175: Home
176: Home
177: Home
178: Home
179: Forums
180: Forums
181: Your Account
182: Your Account
183: Photo Albums
184: Home
185: Photo Albums
186: Forums
187: Home
188: Forums
189: Photo Albums
190: Forums
191: Forums
192: Home
193: Forums
194: Forums
195: Home
196: Forums
197: Forums
198: Forums
199: Forums
200: Home
201: Forums
202: Forums
203: Forums
204: Your Account
205: Forums
206: Photo Albums
207: Home
208: Home
209: Home
210: Photo Albums
211: Photo Albums
212: Forums
213: Home
214: Home
215: Forums
216: Forums
217: Your Account
218: Forums
219: Photo Albums
220: Forums
221: Forums
222: Forums
223: Home
224: Home
225: Forums
226: Forums
227: Forums
228: Home
229: Photo Albums
230: Forums
231: Home
232: Forums
233: Photo Albums
234: Home
235: Home
236: Forums
237: Forums
238: Home
239: Home
240: Home
241: Forums
242: Forums
243: Forums
244: Home
245: Forums
246: Forums
247: Forums
248: Forums
249: Forums
250: Forums
251: Forums
252: Forums
253: Forums
254: Home
255: Photo Albums
256: Forums
257: Forums
258: Forums
259: Forums
260: Photo Albums
261: Home
262: Forums
263: Home
264: PointBlank Online
265: Forums
266: Forums
267: Photo Albums
268: Forums
269: Forums
270: Home
271: Photo Albums
272: Forums
273: Forums
274: Home
275: Photo Albums
276: Forums
277: Photo Albums
278: Photo Albums
279: Forums
280: Photo Albums
281: Forums
282: Home
283: Home
284: Forums
285: Forums
286: Home
287: Home
288: Home
289: Home
290: Home
291: Home
292: Forums
293: News
294: Home
295: Forums
296: Home
297: Home
298: Forums
299: Forums
300: Home
301: Forums
302: Home
303: Home
304: Forums
305: Forums
306: Forums
307: Forums
308: Forums
309: Forums
310: Forums
311: Forums
312: Home
313: Forums
314: Photo Albums
315: Forums
316: Forums
317: Photo Albums
318: Forums
319: Home
320: Forums
321: Home
322: Forums
323: Forums
324: Forums
325: Home
326: Forums
327: Forums
328: Forums
329: Forums
330: Forums
  BOT:
01: Home

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
 

Coppermine Stats
Photo Albums
 Albums: 308
 Pictures: 2458
  · Views: 824942
  · Votes: 1316
  · Comments: 85
 

Get the lead out! gun cleaning
Discussions related to Guns and Firearms
Go to page 1, 2  Next
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Alaskasourdough
Rookie Member
Rookie Member


Joined: Jul 22, 2007
Posts: 2

PostPosted: Sun Jul 22, 2007 9:54 pm    Post subject: Get the lead out! gun cleaning Reply with quote

I do a lot of bullet casting of lead bullets for my 44 mag, and other calibers, for a lot fun plinking and teaching others how to shoot. I found that by taking a normal brass cleaning brush and wrapping a 6-8 inch piece of strand of Chore-Boy copper cleaning pad, around the brass brush with a cleaning solvent, it cleans out the lead very fast. The Chore-Boy copper is hard, but the copper does not scratch the steel barrels!
Back to top
View user's profile
SwampFox
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: Jul 15, 2005
Posts: 1040
Location: Destin, Florida

PostPosted: Mon Jul 23, 2007 9:31 am    Post subject: Re: Get the lead out! gun cleaning Reply with quote

Alaska,
Welcome to the nut house.... Very Happy

Shot cast only, in competition for about 25 years. If you are doing a lot of cast bullet shooting and you are getting leading or fouling you might want to try RB-17. I have used it for near 20 years now and it cleans a gun up like nothing else I have ever seen. It is the only product that I ever found that will clean a comp on a race gun with a tooth brush. This is the site where it is sold, do not look in stores.
Ed

www.rb-treasures.com/product3.html

_________________
The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of the blessings. The inherent blessing of socialism is the equal sharing of misery.
-Winston Churchill
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Alaskasourdough
Rookie Member
Rookie Member


Joined: Jul 22, 2007
Posts: 2

PostPosted: Mon Jul 23, 2007 7:41 pm    Post subject: Re: Get the lead out! gun cleaning Reply with quote

SwampFox wrote:
Alaska,
It is the only product that I ever found that will clean a comp on a race gun with a tooth brush.

If it sounds too good to be true.....
After shooting up to one hundred rounds of hard cast lead, and past cleaning experiences, no tooth brush is going to remove lead from spiral grooves of a .44 mag. Your product seems to be primarily for rust removal.
Back to top
View user's profile
Handloader
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: Aug 22, 2005
Posts: 1032
Location: Phoenix, Arizona

PostPosted: Mon Jul 23, 2007 10:18 pm    Post subject: Re: Get the lead out! gun cleaning Reply with quote

Alaskasourdough: good suggestion, sir. Welcome to the forums and post often. Marshall Stanton of "Beartooth Bullets" recommends a similar method and I have found it effective (check out his website for great bullet casting information). Still it is our human nature to look for easier and faster ways, so, I may try the SwampFox endorsed RB-17 just because I like to try new stuff.

Avoiding leading is probably where I have put my emphasis. Barrels that have been lapped, either hot or cold, have reduced a lot of leading problems for me over the years. Matching the pressure of my loads for the hardness of the bullet, however, was a breakthrough. Here's a fun formula to work with:

Hardness x 1,144 = the pressure at which base obturation takes place. If the bullet is properly sized and run at the proper pressure, little leading will occur when obturation takes place. Leading around the forcing cone and just in front of it suggests inadequate pressure, while leading toward the muzzle end indicates excessive pressure. Of course, having a hardness tester eliminates a lot of the guessing if one can correctly define the pressure of the load.

An old fashioned method of getting leading removed was the useage of mercury. Before it became a "bad" thing, we used it frequently to take the lead out of badly leaded bores. Nothing before or since has been more effective or faster. They have used mercury for such purposes for decades, however, its absence today may be relative to increased shooter longevity.

The Lewis lead removers can be another effective method and, in essence, uses the same idea of using copper scouring pads, however, in a nice and more costly easy to use package.

Gas checked bullets help, too. It increases cost, but, few of us shoot enough that it would make a sizeable dent in the monthly budget.
Back to top
View user's profile
rrogacki
Member
Member


Joined: Apr 22, 2006
Posts: 135
Location: Pennsylvania

PostPosted: Fri Aug 17, 2007 7:47 pm    Post subject: Re: Get the lead out! gun cleaning Reply with quote

I've used the Outers Foul Out system for years now. IMHO, nothing gets lead or copper out any better. Easy as heck to use. It is a sort of reverse electo plating device. Has anyone else tried this system?

_________________
"Bother", said Pooh, as he chambered another round...
Back to top
View user's profile MSN Messenger
Joe Boleo
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: Dec 25, 2006
Posts: 427
Location: Pennsylvania

PostPosted: Sat Aug 18, 2007 4:05 am    Post subject: Re: Get the lead out gun cleaning Reply with quote

Welcome to the forum. My traditional favorites are Shooters Choice, Remington Bore Cleaning, J.B Bore Cleaner and lead wiping cloth to remove leading. My cast bullets are very hard and driven at moderate velocities and I do not have leading problems. Take care...
Joe
Back to top
View user's profile
SwampFox
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: Jul 15, 2005
Posts: 1040
Location: Destin, Florida

PostPosted: Sat Aug 18, 2007 6:08 am    Post subject: Re: Get the lead out! gun cleaning Reply with quote

You guys can try this. I made one years ago and it is in my reloading room right now. It is called the 50 Cent Foul Out. I made a plastic funnel that is cut to muzzle diameter and duct taped to the exterior of the barrel.

ca.geocities.com/snide...eaner.html

But it does not do much for lead.
Ed

_________________
The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of the blessings. The inherent blessing of socialism is the equal sharing of misery.
-Winston Churchill
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
rrogacki
Member
Member


Joined: Apr 22, 2006
Posts: 135
Location: Pennsylvania

PostPosted: Sat Aug 18, 2007 11:35 am    Post subject: Re: Get the lead out! gun cleaning Reply with quote

SwampFox wrote:
You guys can try this. I made one years ago and it is in my reloading room right now. It is called the 50 Cent Foul Out. I made a plastic funnel that is cut to muzzle diameter and duct taped to the exterior of the barrel.

ca.geocities.com/snide...eaner.html

But it does not do much for lead.
Ed

SwampFox
The 50 Cent Foul Out is gonna put Outers outta business. I'm gonna put one together and compare the two, but I bet the 50 Cent will beat the commercial product in a heartbeat. The website is pretty interesting too.
Best Of Luck

_________________
"Bother", said Pooh, as he chambered another round...
Back to top
View user's profile MSN Messenger
Deleted_User_2665
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: May 06, 2006
Posts: 380

PostPosted: Sat Aug 18, 2007 8:08 pm    Post subject: Re: Get the lead out! gun cleaning Reply with quote

Okay....I'm game.

But can anyone know if the solution in the commercial foul out system is ammonia? As far as I know that system is billed as a use it whenever type thing.

I've always wanted to try one but couldn't like parting with that cash for something I could do a cheaper way, albeit with a little more elbow grease.

I've also wanted to build one because the electric part is a no brainer and the plating process as well....it's been the not knowing what the solution was that's hung me up.

Scientifically hypothesizing, what if one of the more "gentler" copper disolving solutions were used.....if the system is based on a disolved copper plating to the rod. Might have to allow more time but maybe there would be no risk of a hurt tube.

This would be cool if the solution would do no harm to the bore.............

On aside...I"m a TIG welder (among other processes) by trade. A piece of TIG filler wire, which is both straight and stiff, would be just the ticket for the "rod". I'll ask my Pop, who is a retired chemistry and physics teacher, if it would matter what metal is best to use. Stainless, Titanium, various grades of carbon...are all easily accessible.
Back to top
View user's profile
rrogacki
Member
Member


Joined: Apr 22, 2006
Posts: 135
Location: Pennsylvania

PostPosted: Sat Aug 18, 2007 10:29 pm    Post subject: Re: Get the lead out! gun cleaning Reply with quote

Hi wildswalker,

I checked my bottles of solution from Outers. The Cop Out solution states that it contains Copper Acetate and Ammonium Acetate. The Lead Out contains Lead Acetate and Ammonium Acetate. Don't know what this stuff is and I have no idea where to get the raw chemicals, but you can buy the solutions from the Outers website.

Good Luck

_________________
"Bother", said Pooh, as he chambered another round...
Back to top
View user's profile MSN Messenger
K.W.
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: Mar 19, 2007
Posts: 348
Location: Finland

PostPosted: Sun Aug 19, 2007 12:11 am    Post subject: Re: Get the lead out! gun cleaning Reply with quote

Moi. I put some Hornady HP/XTP bullets backwards in the cases and use them during shooting time if there is heavy leading. K.W.
Back to top
View user's profile
Deleted_User_2665
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: May 06, 2006
Posts: 380

PostPosted: Sun Aug 19, 2007 10:15 am    Post subject: Re: Get the lead out! gun cleaning Reply with quote

rrogacki wrote:
Hi wildswalker,

I checked my bottles of solution from Outers. The Cop Out solution states that it contains Copper Acetate and Ammonium Acetate. The Lead Out contains Lead Acetate and Ammonium Acetate. Don't know what this stuff is and I have no idea where to get the raw chemicals, but you can buy the solutions from the Outers website.

Good Luck

Good info...

I'll check with Pop on just what exactly that stuff is....he's savvy on all things Chemistry.

By definition acetate means a salt or ester........

Mebbe just buying the Outers solution would be the simplist route as I'm thinkin' most of the cost incured is in the magical electronic device sourced initially.
Back to top
View user's profile
Deleted_User_2665
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: May 06, 2006
Posts: 380

PostPosted: Sun Aug 19, 2007 10:21 am    Post subject: Re: Get the lead out! gun cleaning Reply with quote

Per the original tenor of this thread....

Keeping velocities within the bounds of cast lead lends heavily towards unleaded barrels....

As does using the proper bullet lube and gas check design bullets...............
Back to top
View user's profile
Deleted_User_2665
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: May 06, 2006
Posts: 380

PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2007 6:39 pm    Post subject: Re: Get the lead out! gun cleaning Reply with quote

Checked with Dad on this and he's gonna research a few things....

He did say though per the firing of a CF with copper bullets there are two things deposited in the bore. One being a physical transfer of metallic copper, the other being copper oxide which is a reaction of the burning gases on the deposited copper solids.

Little can be done with the metallic copper short of a mechanical removal such as vigorous brushing, or the introduction of acids too powerful for the barrel metal to withstand.

The blue color found on cleaning patches with the use of a commercial copper "solvent" is the removal of the copper oxide. Thinking back on it, I've notice the blue stop and a phase of green appear. This would indicate the copper oxide to be removed and the "solvent" is then working on the metallic copper....so Dad's not pulling my leg.

His opinion of the Foul Out system is that, with the given solution of Copper Acetate, it's only working on the copper oxide as that's the easiest to "loosen" and make "stick" to the rod. To actually "plate" the copper metallics onto the rod would require the solids to be put into "solution" and that would require a much more powerful electrolosis medium than just ammonia, or the copper acetate. Likely an acid which no sane person would want to put in their rifle.

Many things are marketed successfully in this world to unsuspecting consumers due to the lack of understanding or to ignorance. Case in point, if the "blue" is gone then the copper must be too...

I'm guilty of that one myself..........
Back to top
View user's profile
SwampFox
Super Member
Super Member


Joined: Jul 15, 2005
Posts: 1040
Location: Destin, Florida

PostPosted: Wed Aug 22, 2007 7:09 am    Post subject: Re: Get the lead out! gun cleaning Reply with quote

Now just think a second, forget sporting guns, how long would an M-16, M-60 or M-2 function if the bullet jacket copper remained in the bore and built up in the bore? As a former military armoror and member of the 101st Airborne Division I have examined hundreds of these guns after cleaning with military bore solvent and they have no copper residue that could be seen or picked up with a patch. No gun is ever turned in to the arms room without a solvent and white patch inspection. These guns were never cleaned with"an acid which no sane person would want to put in their rifle."

When an M-16, M-60 or Ma-duce barrel wears out, it is always over bore, it is never discarded due to constriction by copper fouling. If a trooper ever brought a fouled bore to me, he would be doing the dying cockroach and 4 count pushups for the rest of his natural life.
Ed

_________________
The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of the blessings. The inherent blessing of socialism is the equal sharing of misery.
-Winston Churchill
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic   Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index » Gun & Firearm Discussions
Page 1 of 2
All times are GMT - 7 Hours
Go to page 1, 2  Next



Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum


Valid CSS! Valid HTML 4.01!
Click to check if this page is realy HTML 4.01 compliant for speed :)

All logos and trademarks in this site are property of HuntingNut.com.
The comments are property of their posters, all the rest © 2011 by HuntingNut.com
Interactive software released under GNU GPL, Code Credits, Privacy Policy

.: Upgraded to DragonFly 9.2 by *Dizfunkshunal* :.