Well actually Joe, I just looked at Hodgdon and every bullet from 110gr to 200gr has the '06 substancialy faster.

d_hoffman wrote:

Well actually Joe, I just looked at Hodgdon and every bullet from 110gr to 200gr has the '06 substancialy faster.

I am merely quoting the Speer test results, only because I thought it hard to believe myself. I'd have sworn that 30-06 would outperform a 308.

hj21; I also read that in the speer manual. I also own and load for both 308 & 30/06 and I have not found this to be true. I still have some different powders to test with the 308 but as yet no 308 loads match my 06. Of all my different manuals hodgdon's listed velocities seem the closest to actual measured speeds.
Don

A17Shooter wrote:

Vince wrote: Just finished reading this short article and thought.....what the hey....lets chuck the cat amongst the pigeons. Vince, That's a term that is new to me. Brings up an interesting picture though.

Gidday mate...the term is an Australian one that basically means what it says....lets "stir" things up a bit....create a bit of havoc....works for me.

I've never actually owned either a .308 or a 30.06, although I have used both calibres in sporting and military firearms. I used the .308 extensively in the guise of a 7.62mm NATO SLR (FN) rifle, the M60 GPMG, MAG 58 (English L7) MG and L4 Bren Gun in 7.62mm, for many years whilst in the Army and found it to be a relatively accurate, for military ammo, round. The bulk of my experience with the 30.06 was in the .30BMG. The only "sporter" I used the 30.06 in was an ex military rifle anyway.

Having never reloaded or done a detailed or exhaustive test on the capabilities (accuracy) of either round I suppose I can only offer limited advice. However, of the many thousands of rounds I have fired from these firearms I never had any problems hitting what I was aiming at, which included kangaroos at 300m with the 30.06 sporter.

What was I hoping to achieve by opening this thread.....spirited debate.

I know that there are many members here who have one or both calibres in their armoury and we also have a number of newer shooters who stand to benefit from the experiences of those more experienced, myself included.

Hopefully, and I think I have, achieved this outcome.

Cheers, Vince

Mr Hoffman..


I am simply quoting a reliable source.

Hey Joe. Not trying to egg you on bud, I'm simply quoting different reliable info from a powder manufacturer that I use almost exclusively. As Vince put it, it's just a spirited debate.

I have had a .308 in the past and my older brother had an '06. Frankly I wasn't real impressed with either one. Personaly, I prefer a .270 or 7mm Rem mag.

More powder more power.
Vince I nearly replied when you first posted this thread, the comment was going to be along the lines of 'you sh*t stirrer you'. I now believe that the thread should be along the lines that
'All 30 calibres are hopeless, underpowered, inaccurate, worthless wasters of time and money, and a world wide ban on the sale of all 30 cal projectiles and cartridges to be enforced immediately" would have been more appropriate

I own 270 - 308 - and 30-06 and reload for them all. My favorite is the 270. Don't know if it's because of actions the .308 is a pump 7600. But the 270 and 30-06 are both bolt action Remington 700s. I think it's the fact that the 06 kick the sh*t out of you while the 270 doesn't. Never felt the need for all the power you can get out of the 06. At the range I've never found a load for the 06 or 308 that shoots better than my 270 loads.

Have fun.

I don't mean to put down the 30-06, but, the Army Match Team has pretty much went to shooting the 300WinMag, jumping over the 30-06, instead of shooting the .308. They have done this because the bigger 300WinMag will give better accuracy in winds.
I figure that the experts in the Army would have gone to the 30-06 if it came close to the other two in accuracy.

I do a lot of reloading and shooting different loads, and have found that I can get tighter groups with the .308 and 300WinMag over the 30-06. Even my .358, which is just a necked up .308, will beat the '06 on the range with the right reloads, and more reasonable ranges.

BUT just like Bushy says, for hunting, any of these calibers shoot better than I can while in the woods, so, who cares except the match shooters, and us guys who like to play in the reloading rooms and the ranges like I do.

Eric

WELL! Good discussion...again. Always a thought provoker, akin to the proposition: "Mah Dawg is UGLIER"N Yourn!

Yup, the ole '06 won a major war, could have won another couple, were it not for the dunderheaded pols in Washington, and has done just fine for what??? 100+ years?
The .308 came along about 1958 or so, and will do anything the '06 can do in a military context. Evidence seems to indicate for target shooting, it may even be better. Maybe lots. It seems that learning has taken place.

For hunting? Toss a coin. Less recoil, even at the differences touted between the .270, .308 and '06, seem to make a difference for some, in that they can shoot it better. That's why the .243 is so popular, and effective in properly schooled hands.

For the average Joe, The main question is: "Wil it kick me, so I will not enjoy it, and develop a flinch?" Next: " Can I provide accuracy enough to kill game humanely, at reasonable distances?" Whatever works!

Hi
The 3006 is a great cartridge , and when handloaded to near maximum power , you can say it is a 300 Win. Mag. this you cannot do with the Win. 308 . I like the 3006 better than the 300 Win. Mag. for the reason that you can use all the 30 caliber bullets on the market , and the 300 Win. Mag. you cannot use bullets made with thin core jackets limiting your choice.

Tooki

ElyBoy wrote:

I don't mean to put down the 30-06, but, the Army Match Team has pretty much went to shooting the 300WinMag, jumping over the 30-06, instead of shooting the .308. They have done this because the bigger 300WinMag will give better accuracy in winds.

Eric,

The AMU actually spent more time shooting the .30-338 than it did the 300WM. IIRC, most of their 30 cal records were set with the .30-338. These days, they use heavy bullets in poodle shooters.

FALPhil wrote:

poodle shooters ?????

OK Phil....ya got me on this one mate. Didn't realise there was a calibre specified for shooting poodles.

Cheers, Vince

Vince,

A firearm chambered in 223Rem (or 5.56x45mm NATO) is called a Poodle gun, or a mouse gun, I do believe Jeff Cooper had something to do with thouse names.

Dimitri

I think one factor that has been overlooked here is that matches tend to be shot with the "current" military round. The guys that used the .30-06 in the service stuck with it. Ditto for the 7.62 NATO/.308 and now the 5.56 NATO/.223. Remember, at one time the .45-70 was THE 1000 yard target round.

As far as power... Which is more powerful, a 150 grain bullet at 2800 fps or a 150 grain bullet at 2800 fps? I don't think there is any SIGNIFICANT difference between the two until you get into the heavier bullets.