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What did I miss along the way ?
Discussion regarding the reloading of ammunition and tuning of loads for accuracy
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pete4d
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 10, 2021 2:46 pm    Post subject: What did I miss along the way ? Reply with quote

What Scratch did I miss along the way ?

My step son brought me some .308 win (Hornady) hulls awhile back, finally got around to sizing and de-priming . Started to prime with federal LR primers , WTH , the primer pocket is too small . They mic. about half way between the SR & LR primers ,the SR primers just fall in and out , Did Hornady start using an odd size so I can't reload ,their hulls ? I'd already run into their 45-70 hulls being shorter ?

Had no trouble out of the Win. or the Rem. brass. Scratch

Anyone else ever run into this Scratch

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Vince
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 10, 2021 2:57 pm    Post subject: Re: What did I miss along the way ? Reply with quote

That’s strange mate. I’ve never heard of an odd size primer being manufactured...I would imagine the costs would be too high to set up.

I’m gonna have a stab in the dark here and suggest that the primers were probably crimped which is why the primer pocket appears too small. Have a close look at the primer pocket and I’ll bet you’ll find a crimp of some sort. Once you remove that crimp, LR primers should squeeze in perfectly.

EDIT: A quick search of the net bought up a number of questions asking if Hornady crimp their primers. The answer is a resounding YES. You will need a primer pocket staging tool or a primer pocket reamer to remove the crimp. It’s an easy job that takes but a few seconds with a reamer.

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Elvis
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 10, 2021 6:39 pm    Post subject: Re: What did I miss along the way ? Reply with quote

NAH Vince...stop being so ... Scratch ...easily led....... hornady cases HAVE BEEN CRIMPED...they started doing it about same time they brought out superpreformance factory loads....all YOU NEED to do is...take your case deburring tool,poke the pointy end in primer pocket and give about 3 quick whirls...the amount of material removed is sweet stuff all,puts a lovely champher on beginning of pockets and new primer will slide in like. Scratch Scratch ...a Very Happy well greased,boys thingy,into a slack girly thingy.. Embarassed Embarassed .....
Ive struck ONE brand new remington 45/70 case that pocket is too big..primer just falls back out.
as for the shorter shells in 45/70....its also because of the leverlution loads...it let them crimp on cannalure and have overall length work in the likes of marlin levers..... doesnt worry me in slightest,just reset die for the shorties when loading....Im keeping my long ones for the smelly black stuff as can cram slightly more in .

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English Mike
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 10, 2021 6:54 pm    Post subject: Re: What did I miss along the way ? Reply with quote

I too just stick the nose of my RCBS chamfer tool into crimped pockets unless it's a LOT of cases, then I use the one on my Frankfort case prep station.

Never seen the need for a dedicated swage tool.
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pete4d
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 10, 2021 7:58 pm    Post subject: Re: What did I miss along the way ? Reply with quote

Just as ya'll pointed out ,on the primer pocket . The first thing I did was run them though my RCBS trim mate again . 16 cases total .

Just measured with mic. , the cases again .
.214 = LR
.202 = Hornady cases , there is no crimp edge
.176 =SR

I've used a lot of Hornady cases over the years different calibers but this is a first Scratch ,wish I had the box they came in , but all I have is the brass.

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Elvis
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 11, 2021 12:14 am    Post subject: Re: What did I miss along the way ? Reply with quote

hmmmm and what do hornady have to say???? flick them an email...nothing to loose,at least you will get an answer (and we will too) and if hornady has any brains AT ALL you will get some nice shiney new brass arrive in post.....

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pete4d
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 11, 2021 5:01 am    Post subject: Re: What did I miss along the way ? Reply with quote

Elvis wrote:
hmmmm and what do hornady have to say???? flick them an email...nothing to loose,at least you will get an answer (and we will too) and if hornady has any brains AT ALL you will get some nice shiney new brass arrive in post.....

I read an article a couple years ago, kind of like conspiracy theory at the time , where some of the companies were being pushed by the ATF and anti's to curtail our ability reload . With whats happening now in real time , who knows ? Scratch

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Bushmaster
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 11, 2021 9:36 am    Post subject: Re: What did I miss along the way ? Reply with quote

Pete...I don't have any small rifle primers here to measure, but I was wondering...Could Hornady be using small (or large) pistol primers?

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Elvis
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:40 am    Post subject: Re: What did I miss along the way ? Reply with quote

they could use small rifle....as they do in some other cases but small or large pistol would be too soft/weak and would lead to issues ,possibly even major injuries. bottom line is the cases WERE primed with some sort of primer....really scratching head on this one,look forward to what hornady have to say.

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Vince
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 11, 2021 3:02 pm    Post subject: Re: What did I miss along the way ? Reply with quote

Pete, have you already binned the primers you removed, or are you like me and leave them in the collection tin (I have a large tin they drop into) till there’s quite a few? If you still have the spent primers, run a vernier caliber or micrometer over them to ascertain their physical size.

The crimp on the Hornady factory cases should be, or look like, a depressed ring around the primer pocket...it’s a simple action to remove it. You don’t need a primer pocket swage unless you are a high grade bench rest shooter...a simple primer pocket ream is the tool, and they are inexpensive...$12 to $15. You can use your case mouth chamfer tool as pointed out by others, but I think that tool takes too much metal off which reduces the pocket size a little.



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pete4d
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 12, 2021 12:04 pm    Post subject: Re: What did I miss along the way ? Reply with quote

Vince , They look like your pictures , they mic. the same at the top & bottom of the pocket , I didn't keep the primers Scratch .

Not worth the trouble of buying a swagging tool . only 16-hulls or paper weights . Just never ran into this before , wonder if they have are having the cases out sourced . Scratch

From Hornady this morning

..... thank you for contacting us. Were these cases recovered from factory ammunition? If so, the primer pockets are likely crimped and this crimp will need to be removed with a pocket reamer or swaging tool after the spent primer has been removed. Thanks

_________________
"march to the sound of the guns and shoot everyone not dressed like you"--D I 1968

When the SHTF I'm gonna hunker down until all those idiots kill each other. up-date

The secret to enjoying life is to never take it too seriously, as you will never make it out alive!

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Vince
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 12, 2021 4:13 pm    Post subject: Re: What did I miss along the way ? Reply with quote

Yeah...an inexpensive pocket reamer is the go mate. You might only have a dozen or so cases now, but you may have use for one in the future.

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Illegitimi non carborundum
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Live simply. Love generously. Care deeply. Speak kindly. Leave the rest to God.

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Elvis
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 12, 2021 11:29 pm    Post subject: Re: What did I miss along the way ? Reply with quote

I cant figure out your measurement thing yet...sooooo humour me.....use your deburring tool on ONE case,trim off less than MM worth of material...just a quick whirl,you need to remove less than a fingernail thickness worth...you will see tiny bit of brass removed.......and then try sizing a primer again.
then let us know how you get on...nothing to loose.

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Aloysius
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 13, 2021 1:39 am    Post subject: Re: What did I miss along the way ? Reply with quote

I'm with Elvis. Deburring tool is the way to go. I use it on most of my cases as this helps to prefend ruining primers.
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pete4d
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 13, 2021 5:56 am    Post subject: Re: What did I miss along the way ? Reply with quote

It's not just the outside edge ,it's the whole pocket , top to bottom .

Just ordered a Primer Pocket Uniformer Large Rifle
by RCBS , as my large military crimp remover didn't work Scratch ,,, never ending story on what you may spend on reloading Scratch

_________________
"march to the sound of the guns and shoot everyone not dressed like you"--D I 1968

When the SHTF I'm gonna hunker down until all those idiots kill each other. up-date

The secret to enjoying life is to never take it too seriously, as you will never make it out alive!

I'm on the watch list are you ?
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