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Beginner's 'luck'....
Discussion regarding the reloading of ammunition and tuning of loads for accuracy
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stovepipe
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 9:15 am    Post subject: Re: Beginner's 'luck'.... Reply with quote

Copy that, Vince.

For indoors I'm devolping a milder load under a 200gr plated bullet, X-treme is sending me some free samples to boot. Will make a few at a time and test etc. I'll be researching other powders that have a similar or better case filling volume with less pressure for this 'plinking load'.
Aint that half the fun, researching, testing and loading what you need and want?

For outdoors, in the 10.5" tube'd gun, the START load w/ H110 under a 240gr HP is plenty for all my needs (paper, steels, small game). There is absolutely no need to go hotter than that. And I won't.

*

Quote::
Kevin, did you figure it out yet?

I think I've found the issue.
I sat down with the snubby for another inspection, and, two pairs of magnafier reading glasses.

On the recoil shield, there is a 'chevron' that ramps the rounds up to the firing pin area where the breech face gets thicker, while the cylinder turns. If one looks at it from the muzzle with the cylinder swung out, it looks like the hands of a clock, the minute hand is at 12:00 and the hour hand is at 5:00.
This ramp area is approx 3/4's of an index from the pin.

I took an empty case and traced their path when the cylinder is turning. If I did it just right, the rim would catch.
Holding it in my fingers, the case would move enough to glide over it and continue. My theory is in the chamber there is very little wiggle room so if everything is just right, the round will catch and bind the rotation of the cylinder, and, keep it from swinging out for a re-load.

The '5 o'clock hand' has a curve to it. The rim liked to catch there and on a burr or ridge.

I dressed it a little with a very small diamond-dust file I had handy and it seemed to glide over smoother. It was pretty late last night so I didn't finish the job and want more time to think about how to dress it out right, and, tape up the hand window to keep crud out and tape the cylinder to keep from scratching it etc.

This may correct the issue I had and supports how it fealt when the cylinder was binding as it really did feel like something was impeading on the cylinder's rotoation (like something caught in the spoke of a wheel) as opposed to an action or timing issue.

*

Loading bench should be finished this weekend too. Rain's coming, will have some time to tinker with things.

Keep ya'll posted.

Now- go outside and shoot sumpin'. I am.
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stovepipe
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 10:27 am    Post subject: Re: Beginner's 'luck'.... Reply with quote

ElyBoy wrote:

1- Remember what Forest Gump said guys: "Stupid is, as Stupid Does"
These posts on handloading are starting to sound exactly like a Forest Gump movie.

As a Rangemaster, if I knew that a guy was doing this with his reloads, I would eject him off of my range and only allow him in the future to shoot factory ammo only.

Un-stink'en-believable

Eric

2- Now, putting a beginner handloader with H110, and on top of that, loading so hot as to even worry about the primers is REALLY not cool.

I don't know if you shoot with other folks, but doing what you are doing, I would shoot alone without the chance of "collateral" damage to other shooters



1- So- factory stuff is better and safer.
Like the large hunk of thrice struck brass I pulled from insde the case of that S/W round I broke down last week?
Yeh- never had a factory piece hang-fire etc...


2- So- what you are saying is load light and don't check?
I check every case and every primer after firing.
Regardless.
Period.

When it comes to shooting, I worry about everything and sweat the details.
Guns, to me, are like a Swiss watch that can kill. I worry about and sweat every aspect and detail about them. I'm in no hurry to do something wrong. I'm human, can make mistakes, other will and do as well.

In order to KB an Alaskan, there'd have to be so much powder in the case it would spill over and good luck hand setting a bullet pre-seat. This would be caught by me.

Take a pill buddy. Really.
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ElyBoy
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 11:02 am    Post subject: Re: Beginner's 'luck'.... Reply with quote

Don't take it personal Stovepipe.

No, I don't check my brass after shooting it.
All of my loads are well within limits, so no need to be paranoid about it.
I do check the brass as I reload though.
If I were to load your type of loads--you bet-- I would check all of the brass.
As a matter of fact, I would most likely toss them after one reload.

As far as factory ammo goes--you bet--I stand by my statement.

I know that factory ammo is loaded down, and I also know that they are loaded under strict standards, by qualified people.

Please take my last sentence--"Strict standards, by qualified people"--personally.

Like I say all of the time Partner--"I calls 'em as I sees 'em"

There are many, many, years of knowledge around here, with great folks who are more than willing to share their knowledge.
Listen to these guys, and learn a little.

I just picked up last night at my local Gun Shop, Lyman's 49th edition Reloading Handbook.
I cross reference with different books when loading different loads.
I like Lyman and Hornady the best, but also use Nosler and Speer, and, I buy soft cover books on each calibre which combines all reloading manuals.

Years ago, Bushy gave me a reloading formula for my .38sp, that I share with other shooters even now.

Listen and learn, and don't get your feather all ruffled up, because you don't hear what you want to hear.

Fr. Eric

No No!

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Pumpkinslinger
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 12:16 pm    Post subject: Re: Beginner's 'luck'.... Reply with quote

Kevin, a rough spot there could do it, hope you got it fixed! Let us know.

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stovepipe
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 1:24 pm    Post subject: Re: Beginner's 'luck'.... Reply with quote

Thanks Mike, me too. Will try again tomorrow at the range and see how she goes.

*

Also- X-treme is sending me some free samples- 200gr FP plated bullets.
I want to make a reduced load for indoors for the snubby (Alaskan 44m) and I'm leary about short loading H110.

Any recomendations for a powder that will still fill the case with a reduced load using standard primers?
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Pumpkinslinger
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 2:37 pm    Post subject: Re: Beginner's 'luck'.... Reply with quote

How "reduced"? Look at Trail Boss powder.

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stovepipe
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 2:44 pm    Post subject: Re: Beginner's 'luck'.... Reply with quote

Around 1000fps'ish or...?
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damianss
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 2:55 pm    Post subject: Re: Beginner's 'luck'.... Reply with quote

ElyBoy wrote:
Don't take it personal Stovepipe.

No, I don't check my brass after shooting it.
All of my loads are well within limits, so no need to be paranoid about it.
I do check the brass as I reload though.
If I were to load your type of loads--you bet-- I would check all of the brass.
As a matter of fact, I would most likely toss them after one reload.

As far as factory ammo goes--you bet--I stand by my statement.

I know that factory ammo is loaded down, and I also know that they are loaded under strict standards, by qualified people.

Please take my last sentence--"Strict standards, by qualified people"--personally.

Like I say all of the time Partner--"I calls 'em as I sees 'em"

There are many, many, years of knowledge around here, with great folks who are more than willing to share their knowledge.
Listen to these guys, and learn a little.

I just picked up last night at my local Gun Shop, Lyman's 49th edition Reloading Handbook.
I cross reference with different books when loading different loads.
I like Lyman and Hornady the best, but also use Nosler and Speer, and, I buy soft cover books on each calibre which combines all reloading manuals.

Years ago, Bushy gave me a reloading formula for my .38sp, that I share with other shooters even now.

Listen and learn, and don't get your feather all ruffled up, because you don't hear what you want to hear.

Fr. Eric

No No!

this just shows how little you know about reloading--toss the brass after one loading? why would you do that? The brass is completely enclosed in the steel of the gun--it cant go anywhere and wont go anywhere unless you load some crazy load that far exceeds the pressure limitation of the gun involved. straight walled pistol cases can be safely loaded until the neck starts to crack then toss them--or trim them down if the are magnums to the special length and load them as say 38 spl from the 357 mag brass. Secondly factory loaded ammunition is loaded tho whatever the sammi spec calls for for that cartridge. Most factory loaders try to use a powder that achieves a decent velocity maintaining the same pressure that uses the least amount of powder. This is a cost savings to them. Why load with H-110 for 38,000psi and 24 grains when some of the powders give good velocity with say 14 grains of a different powder but still the same pressure. Pressure being the key.
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Pumpkinslinger
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 3:00 pm    Post subject: Re: Beginner's 'luck'.... Reply with quote

988-ish? Wink Hodgdon's "Annual Manual" loads for a .44 Mag show a 200 grain cast bullet with a MAX load of 7.7 grains of Trail Boss for 988 ft/sec from an 8" barrel, 20,200 CUP. I'm not sure how much velocity you'd lose with the snubby. I'm suggesting this because of your desire to fill the case.

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stovepipe
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 3:09 pm    Post subject: Re: Beginner's 'luck'.... Reply with quote

Exactly what I'm trying to do.... fill the case, damp down the obnoxious factor for those around me indoors. And save some wear on my fillings.

Thanks Mike, very much.

Cool
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chambered221
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 3:32 pm    Post subject: Re: Beginner's 'luck'.... Reply with quote

Keep in mind Trailboss was designed for lead bullets only !!!

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stovepipe
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 3:45 pm    Post subject: Re: Beginner's 'luck'.... Reply with quote

Yep- copper plated lead bullet. No jacket.

'X-treme' recomends lower velocities with these bullets. As stated per them- under 1500fps.

Not sure if the plated part is an issue...any thoughts?
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Pumpkinslinger
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 7:17 pm    Post subject: Re: Beginner's 'luck'.... Reply with quote

I'm sure I've seen jacketed bullet loads using Trail Boss in the Hodgdon manual. I'll have to double check later.

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chambered221
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 8:21 pm    Post subject: Re: Beginner's 'luck'.... Reply with quote

Trailboss is marketed under IMR !!!

The book I have is from 2005 and states low velocity lead bullets.

If that has changed I would definitly be intrested !!!

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gelandangan
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 8:35 pm    Post subject: Re: Beginner's 'luck'.... Reply with quote

Stovie, using 22+ grains on a 2 inch snubbie means having a lot of unburnt powder burn OUTSIDE the gun.

22+ grain on the loading books is tested using a gun that is a bit longer than yours.

I think if you are after velocity in the snubbie, you should try some faster powder, because slow powder on a snubbie do not burn efficiently.

Another thing, there is no problem shooting magnum load on a magnum gun.
But there is difference between trying to get the best out of your load against getting the loudest boom or highest pressure.

If you can replicate the velocity of A LOT of slow powder with a small amount of faster powder SAFELY, you are indeed getting better efficiency.
And as a bonus, you got a gun that will be a lot more controllable and fun to shoot.

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