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6mm remington
Discussion regarding the reloading of ammunition and tuning of loads for accuracy
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SingleShotLover
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2011 4:42 am    Post subject: Re: 6mm remington Reply with quote

It's not unusual to find that manufacturers' listed OALs turn out to be a little off. Remember that each chamber is not identical as to minute dimension differences and throat lengths. Keep adjusting the seating depth until your cartridges chamber properly and, if they are shorter than suggested, decrease your powder charge for initial testing (as you should with any load anyway) and work up slowly.

I've found chambers with short throats that couldn't chamber "standard" OAL cartridges and others that would allow bullets to be seated way out there. Each rifle is different and the reason that careful handloading often gives superior accuracy over factory rounds.

It's your choice between neck-sizing and full-length sizing. Many people make sure that their cases have been full-length sized for hunting to ensure that each cartridge will chamber properly in the heat of fast reloading while neck-sizing for target and varmints.

Bullet weight, within reason, in the smaller calibers isn't as critical as bullet construction. The Barnes bullets hold together and penetrate as a result of velocity rather than mass. Penetration and a reasonable amount of expansion should do what you want.

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chrispbrown27
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2011 5:17 am    Post subject: Re: 6mm remington Reply with quote

I have checked the oal of a factory round and it runs in the 2.7xx range. Some of the load data with IMR4320 calls for an oal in the 2.7xx range (I believe 2.744 but I do not have the book in front of me). I have loaded a few like this and they chamber fine. So I guess basically my issue is with the H4831sc since the books call for 2.825 oal and as large as the powder is if I seat the bullet much deeper I will have a compressed load even using starting load data. Can anyone suggest a different powder? I have read on many reloading sites that H4350 is the powder for the 6mm, but I forget it everytime I get near a gun shop, any other suggestions?
I think that an 85 or 80 gr. x-bullet would certainly do the job, but I just can't help but wonder if I would be better off with a 90-100 gr. bullet. I have always thought that hitting them with a ton of bricks is better than threading a needle through their heart.
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Vince
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2011 6:07 am    Post subject: Re: 6mm remington Reply with quote

I just had a look at the latest ADI Handloaders' Guide and it lists both powders you mention for the 6mm Rem.

ADI manufacture these powders for Hogdon -

AR2208 is marketed as Varget by Hogdon
AR2209 is marketed as 4350 by Hogdon
AR2213SC is marketed as H4831SC by Hogdon

Bullet Weight.....Powder........Start Load...Velocity fps...Max Load...Velocity fps

75gn..................AR2208........37.0gn...........3185.........41.0gn.........3395
75gn..................AR2209........44.0gn...........3175.........49.0gn.........3500
75gn..................AR2213SC....48.0gn...........3210.........51.0gn.........3490

A different powder...I would suggest you give Varget some thought mate...it is a brilliant powder, what I consider to be probably the best all round powder on the market today.

Neither of these loads are listed as compressed loads. Unfortunately this book doesn't give OAL measurements.

Cheers, Vince

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chrispbrown27
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2011 10:17 am    Post subject: Re: 6mm remington Reply with quote

I have considered varget, but when you get into heavier bullets the powder is not listed for these weights.
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Ominivision1
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2011 10:37 am    Post subject: Re: 6mm remington Reply with quote

Go to Hodgdon's web site and you can see that Varget is indeed used for lightest to the heaviest bullets. It's a very versatile powder.

Hodgdons Web Site

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chrispbrown27
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2011 2:02 pm    Post subject: Re: 6mm remington Reply with quote

After I posted that last message I looked in my Lee book and there are some heavier varget loads in there. I have looked at the Hodgdon site before but never for varget. Plenty of loads on there for the powder, but when I decide what bullets I am going to try out for my deer loads I will break down and buy the load manuals for those brands. Right now these are my front runners: 90 gr. e-tip, 90 gr. accubond, and 100 gr. partition. I am somewhat interested in x-bullets, interbonds and sst's but don't know if I will get around to trying them out this year.
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Vince
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2011 7:38 pm    Post subject: Re: 6mm remington Reply with quote

Well Chris...as far as I am concerned, you are doing the right thing mate. Look at what you want to achieve, look around at what is available, then ask questions...can't do it any better than that mate.

Keep us tabbed on how things pan out mate...your experiences will no doubt help some of us in here.

Cheers, Vince

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chambered221
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2011 10:02 pm    Post subject: Re: 6mm remington Reply with quote

Chris, Welcome to Hunting Nut !!!

The 2.825 OAL is nothing more than the maximum length that ammo manufactures must adhere to under SAAMI specifications. Lighter weight bullets will typically have a shorter OAL.

As a handloader this simply tells you the max length if you want to maintain use of the magazine in a repeating arm.

Seating bullets longer or shorter than the SAAMI spec is a practice that is widely used and accepted amongst handloaders.
Having a understanding of the process is a must !!!

You are doing the smart thing by asking questions first and erring on the side of caution.

As for your problem ............. Sierra load data (3rd Edition) list the 75gr. HP at 2.810
Since you are unable to chamber that bullet at that length I would be questioning if that's what you really have ???
Have you weighed the bullets to confirm their weight ? The length of it should be .815

The rounds you shot at starting loads .............. was it hard to open the bolt after firing ?

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chrispbrown27
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 5:10 am    Post subject: Re: 6mm remington Reply with quote

But the shorter you go the more pressure. I am very confident that the bullets are 75 gr. sierra hollow points. My Dad was very particular about things and the only boxes of 6mm bullets he had were 75 gr. sierra's. Their weights vary slightly, which I would assume is quite normal. Someone mentioned seating the bullet at the maximum depth my chamber will allow and then loading light and slowly building until I notice signs of pressure. I think this is my best option. How far below the published starting load would you guys be willing to go?
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chambered221
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 5:54 am    Post subject: Re: 6mm remington Reply with quote

Yes..... a shorter OAL will cause the pressure to rise !!!

IMO the starting loads are low enough but if it were me I'd figure out what is causing the discrepancy first.
Someone suggested a chamber casting....... that would tell you if the chamber has a short throat.

Did you measure the bullets length ? It should be .815

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chrispbrown27
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 6:34 pm    Post subject: Re: 6mm remington Reply with quote

How exactly do you have a chamber casting done? Or is it something that you can do at home? I keep forgetting to measure the length of the bullets. I will tomorrow and post up what I find.
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Vince
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 9:54 pm    Post subject: Re: 6mm remington Reply with quote

chrispbrown27 wrote:
How exactly do you have a chamber casting done? Or is it something that you can do at home? I keep forgetting to measure the length of the bullets. I will tomorrow and post up what I find.

Chamber Casting

Chamber Cast 2

www.manthei-mess-syste..._intro.htm

Cheers, Vince

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Elvis
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 10:10 pm    Post subject: Re: 6mm remington Reply with quote

hers a challenge for you get a norma load a pmc load a winchester load all the same weight and type eg 130grn splitza and compare how big they look. the pmc will look biggest the norma the smallest. the density of the metal must have alot to do with the physical size of the projectile.
you have tried remington factory with no bother so if you make your reload the same size it should fit just as well.if your reload projectile is alot blunter maybe it will engage the rifling sooner if its a splitzer/pointy end it should still fit/chamber nicely. most projectiles I have dealt with taper back nicely and the fat part of the shank is easy to distinguish.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 11:49 pm    Post subject: Re: 6mm remington Reply with quote

Some great advise from the above posters. Make sure that you resize the used brass enough, (adjust dies to spec, some chambers are tighter then others as I found in my two 6mms) Here's a great deer load if your interested. 87 gr hpbt Hornady with a near max load of IMR 4320 or IMR 4895.

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SingleShotLover
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 14, 2011 4:31 am    Post subject: Re: 6mm remington Reply with quote

chrispbrown27 wrote:
But the shorter you go the more pressure.

Up until I got the most recent issue of Handloader Magazine I would have agreed entirely. I was always of the assumption that seating bullets deeper in the case raised pressure. According to an article in the magazine, this is true only of pistol cartridges and their fast (in comparison to even the fastest rifle powder) powders. Seating the case deeper within the case (within reason) does not increase pressure with rifle powders according to the article.

Learn something new everyday!

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