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wrestledonce Rookie Member
Joined: Apr 28, 2013 Posts: 5
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Posted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 2:01 am Post subject: Empty Brass hung in gun and Bolt now broken.... |
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Long story, but I am looking for some suggestions....
1. I have a fired brass that is hung in my rifle.
2. I had this happen before and was able to rotate the bolt and tap it back with a rubber mallet, pulled the brass without issue.
3. I could rotate the bolt, tried to tap the bolt back on the Rem. 700 action with a rubber mallet and the bolt broke off. I was using a little more force this time, my fault.
Now I have empty brass hung in the gun and no bolt on the action. Here is my thinking, give me your thoughts.
1. Try to drive the brass out with a dowel rod from the barrel side (assumes the bolt / action is fully open which I think it is) - should have done this in the first place... and it looks to be the favored recommendation when trolling the web.
2. With the above, could use oil down the barrel to help lubricate. Noted several times in searches others suggestion Kroll oil. Try driving out with dowel after giving it some time to soak / lubricate.
3. Using dry ice in the above to freeze the chamber - steel and brass freeze / thaw at different rates. Try diving out while freezing and then while thawing.
4. If above fails, take it to a gunsmith and have the barrel unscrewed, removing the barrel should free the brass, allow the action to work properly.
5. Once the action is freed and the brass has been removed, send the bolt and action to a gun smith to be Tig welded back on or soldered back on... (guy in Alaska at www.accu-tig.com charges $40 to Tig bolt on).
Thoughts or suggestions?
Thanks, Chris
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gelandangan Super Member
Joined: May 07, 2006 Posts: 6398 Location: Sydney Australia
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Posted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 3:05 am Post subject: Re: Empty Brass hung in gun and Bolt now broken.... |
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I suggest to use dowel from the muzzle.
I also suggest to get the chamber polished once the brass is out.
Your gunsmith should usually able to reattach the bolt handle.
Check your extractor claw, it might be damaged if the force on it is high enough to snap the bolt.
Next check if your load is over pressured.. It may be dangerous if not fixed.
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Vince Site Admin
Joined: May 25, 2005 Posts: 15718 Location: Brisbane AUSTRALIA
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Suzanne Super Member
Joined: Jun 27, 2009 Posts: 3323 Location: Eugene, Oregon
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Posted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 6:44 am Post subject: Re: Empty Brass hung in gun and Bolt now broken.... |
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Or the easy way, and take it to a gunsmith to deal with it. Sounds like it will end up in his hands soon anyway. You've already broke something, maybe he can keep you from breaking something else. (I don't mean that to sound so harsh) but he might have a better idea and be able to save you more grief.
The dowel sounds good but if there's no bullet in the case then the dowel will be hammered against the open mouth of the case and the wood will splinter and split on the case mouth which may wedge the case and the wood making a bad situation worse. Consider some other material as the dowel needs to be hard but not damaging to the chamber.
Let us know how it goes! It's always nice to hear a solution to a problem.
_________________ May the moon keep you centered,
May the sun keep you dancing,
And the stars shed light on your dreams. |
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Bushmaster Super Member
Joined: Jun 12, 2005 Posts: 11393 Location: Ava, Missouri
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Posted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 8:19 am Post subject: Re: Empty Brass hung in gun and Bolt now broken.... |
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WHAT IS THE LOAD DATA YOU ARE USING???
_________________ I have one nerve left and yer standin' on it...
DEMOCRACY Two wolves and one sheep voting on what to have for lunch...
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TRBLSHTR Super Member
Joined: Mar 23, 2007 Posts: 1071 Location: Lower 48's-left coast(near portlandia)
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Ominivision1 Super Member
Joined: Sep 20, 2010 Posts: 2984 Location: Iowa
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Posted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 1:26 pm Post subject: Re: Empty Brass hung in gun and Bolt now broken.... |
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Did this same thing 20 years ago on my M700 30/06, I was able to open the bolt but that was it. Drove out the brass with a brass dowel rod slighlty smaller than .308. Using a dead blow (compound) hammer hitting the dowel rod till it backed out slowly, I would not use a wooden dowel rod at all, as it may compound the problem even more if it breaks. Good luck.
_________________ Regards
Limitations are but boundaries created inside our minds. |
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TRBLSHTR Super Member
Joined: Mar 23, 2007 Posts: 1071 Location: Lower 48's-left coast(near portlandia)
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shrpshtrjoe Super Red Neck Member
Joined: Jan 26, 2005 Posts: 2965 Location: Maryland
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Posted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 2:27 pm Post subject: Re: Empty Brass hung in gun and Bolt now broken.... |
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There's good advice above. Definitely check your load data ...
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Pumpkinslinger Super Member
Joined: Sep 22, 2007 Posts: 5002 Location: NC foothills
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Posted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 4:55 pm Post subject: Re: Empty Brass hung in gun and Bolt now broken.... |
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Smartest solution... gun smith. I followed a similar thread on another forum for several days and, after getting a cleaning rod stuck in the bore, he finally took it to a gun smith who fixed it pretty quickly.
_________________ Mike
"I ain't no better than anybody else, and there ain't nobody better than me!" Ma Kettle |
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Elvis Super Member
Joined: Jul 27, 2008 Posts: 9256 Location: south island New Zealand
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Posted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 11:05 pm Post subject: Re: Empty Brass hung in gun and Bolt now broken.... |
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my vote is for a gunsmith too and take along a few of your reloads and fired cases for them to look at aswell. you use a 7mm 300win mag isn't it???
the smith may well be able to suss out what is going wrong
take this as a warning
far better a broken bolt now than a broken face/head later or have a hunt ruined by this issue happening again.
_________________ You shot it You pluck it !
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SingleShotLover Super Member
Joined: Dec 26, 2007 Posts: 1005 Location: Illinois
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Posted: Fri Aug 02, 2013 4:44 am Post subject: Re: Empty Brass hung in gun and Bolt now broken.... |
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My vote is for the gunsmith too. You can't be positive that the bolt is indeed in the fully unlocked position. Heavy blows could cause severe damage to your locking lugs and the lug recesses in which they travel. This only compounds the problem making the repair substantially higher in cost. I also have to ask about your load.
Good luck and stay safe.
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MacD Super Member
Joined: Apr 08, 2011 Posts: 1052 Location: Canada
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Posted: Fri Aug 02, 2013 6:36 am Post subject: Re: Empty Brass hung in gun and Bolt now broken.... |
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Jammed case from what cause - not enough information. Broken bolt handle from smacking with a hammer. Now its more smacking or take to a professional. If it was mine I would opt for the gunsmith.
_________________ La a'Blair s'math n Cairdean
(Friends are good on the day of battle) |
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PaulS Super Member
Joined: Feb 18, 2006 Posts: 4330 Location: South-Eastern Washington - the State
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Posted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 5:55 pm Post subject: Re: Empty Brass hung in gun and Bolt now broken.... |
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I agree, take the gun and its parts to a gunsmith and then compare your load data to the bullet maker's and the powder maker's loads.
What you are describing points to a load that is developing almost twice the maximum pressure in your gun. That doesn't mean twice the charge just twice the pressure.
For a 3006 using a 165 grain bullet and a maximum charge of H414 (56 - 57 grains) a 5 to 6 grain charge over maximum would generate close to those pressures. It's a combination of the extra powder and the reduction in free space in the cartridge that generates the added pressure. Even if you are using a recommended load it is obviously too much pressure and you need to correct that load.
_________________ Paul
__________________
Speer, Lyman, Hodgdon, Sierra, and Hornady = reliable loading data
So and So's pages on the internet = NOT reliable loading data
Always check data against manuals
NEVER exceed maximum listed loads |
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MacD Super Member
Joined: Apr 08, 2011 Posts: 1052 Location: Canada
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Posted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 6:26 pm Post subject: Re: Empty Brass hung in gun and Bolt now broken.... |
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Would a short chamber and long case account for the over pressure? The only stuck case I have ever seen was in a Mosin Nagent that turned out to have a short headspace problem. Not the usual for a pre-WW1 rifle. Every now and then the owner had bolt closure issues and occasionally a hard opening. Then he bought some newer ammo and got the bolt closed but coundn't get opened. A rubber mallet fixed the problem with the bolt but left the case in the chamber with, I assume, a torn rim. This was at the range and he put it aside. Imet him sometime later at the gunshop I frequent and he said the shops smith got the case out and fixed the tight headspace issue.
_________________ La a'Blair s'math n Cairdean
(Friends are good on the day of battle) |
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