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Tried & True
Discussions related to Guns and Firearms

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slimjim
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Joined: May 16, 2009
Posts: 7151
Location: Fort Worth TX

PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 5:10 am    Post subject: Tried & True Reply with quote

I guess I jump too quickly for something new. When the 150gr Accubond Long Range (ABLR) came out for the .270, I jumped at having a long-range, very low drag bullet for my hunting rifle. I even bought a 8-lb keg of MagPro powder to go with the 300 bullets before they arrived. Turned out the ABLR was so long, I couldn't get the bullet close to the lands, accuracy wasn't great, the advertised BC was greatly inflated, and the bullet was so soft to meet its claimed 1300 fps min opening velocity (1500 fps actual), it fragmented like a grenade with nothing left to penetrate. Was lucky enough to sell the powder and gave away the bullets.

Then Hornady come out with the 145gr ELD-X about the same time as Hodgdon came out with their new Enduron 7977 super powder. Only bought 100 bullets this time but jumped on an 8-lb keg of 7977 for $200. The bullet has not been disappointing. It vey accurate, holds together well for a lead-core cup-core bullet, and exceeds it advertised BC. The powder, which is supposed to provide 130gr velocities with 150gr bullets, was accurate the first time out but was all over the second time out plus it threw my other loads off. Turns out the Enduron leaves a coating on the inside of the barrel as its means to reduce copper fouling. I scrubbed it all out of my barrel and my go-to 129 LRX load with IMR4350 is back to being its old self. But I'm hesitant to let the 7977 touch my barrel again. I haven't been able to sell the powder yet.

I was thinking of trying the 145 ELD-X with 4350 for my elk hunt next month but after taking a pronghorn earlier this week where the bullet went through the off-side shoulder (again) I've asked myself why change. My LRX load has never let me down, connects reliably out to 500 yards, and leaves no lead fragments in the meat. I've got 10 loaded and likely will only need one more round for the next hunt. Guess I have lost my urge to try something new that is advertised to be better.

Just sharing some thought.

_________________
"To anger a conservative, lie to him. To anger a liberal, tell him the truth." - Theodore Roosevelt

"The world is a dangerous place to live; not because of the people who are evil, but because of the people who don't do anything about it." - Albert Einstein


Last edited by slimjim on Fri Oct 06, 2017 6:18 am; edited 1 time in total
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Aloysius
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Joined: Nov 03, 2009
Posts: 2076
Location: B., Belgium

PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 5:56 am    Post subject: Re: Tried & True Reply with quote

Never change a winning team!

And don't change for a change,
only change to improve!


I've learned the hard way, still the advice is for free.
But are you so stupid to think that all good things must cost a lot of money?
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slimjim
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Joined: May 16, 2009
Posts: 7151
Location: Fort Worth TX

PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 6:20 am    Post subject: Re: Tried & True Reply with quote

Aloys, its not uncommon to pay $30/pound of powder around here. Especially, when powder was hard to find during the last administration.

_________________
"To anger a conservative, lie to him. To anger a liberal, tell him the truth." - Theodore Roosevelt

"The world is a dangerous place to live; not because of the people who are evil, but because of the people who don't do anything about it." - Albert Einstein
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Vince
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Joined: May 25, 2005
Posts: 13172
Location: Brisbane AUSTRALIA

PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 6:59 am    Post subject: Re: Tried & True Reply with quote

Slim, I'm a firm believer in the old adage of, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it".

Powder for $30 a lb...I wish. I'm paying upwards of $110 a kg (USD$85 - 2.2lb).

_________________
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Illegitimi non carborundum
(Never let the bastards grind you down)

Live simply. Love generously. Care deeply. Speak kindly. Leave the rest to God.

"Nulla Si Fa Senza Volonta."
(Without Commitment, Nothing Gets Done)
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Aloysius
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Joined: Nov 03, 2009
Posts: 2076
Location: B., Belgium

PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 10:17 am    Post subject: Re: Tried & True Reply with quote

Last kg Vihtavuori N120 cost me about 100 euro and that was 2-3 weeks ago.

When things continue like this I think I have to take some lessons at Stovey's and learn how to shoot bow and arrows...


but SJ, you did it again. You pointed me at the fact that powder could damage my barrel. Till now only lead and copper made me fear.
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Elvis
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Joined: Jul 27, 2008
Posts: 7047
Location: south island New Zealand

PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 1:58 pm    Post subject: Re: Tried & True Reply with quote

we pay $70-90 a lb and at moment can get win 748 for $45 a lb from one supplier so that takes care of .223 and .308 nicely
Ive been reading reports of fellas getting very good speeds with superpreformance powder and 140-145 grn pills in .270 win
Im quite happy with the AR2213/H4831 that works for me...sure its nice to think we can do better but with 19" barrel its just not going to happen,one day she will get a birthday and get brand new 26" barrel..trouble will then be do I stick to std .270 or bump out shoulders to an A.I. version with corresponding die set to purchase or try dirty06.....one day I will face those questions but not today.

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Them who eats the most duck eats the most feathers!
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DallanC
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Joined: Jan 18, 2005
Posts: 3159
Location: Utah

PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 2:36 pm    Post subject: Re: Tried & True Reply with quote

I love 4350 for 243/7mm08'ish SA sized cartridges. I havent tried it in the 223 sized cases. Its probably very good in the longer cased cartridges too.


-DallanC
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Vince
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Joined: May 25, 2005
Posts: 13172
Location: Brisbane AUSTRALIA

PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 3:25 pm    Post subject: Re: Tried & True Reply with quote

I've had good results with AR2208 (Varget) in .223 .243 and 30.30, however I've now switched over to another ADI powder with similar characteristics to 2208, only with a much smaller granule, Benchmark 8208 and it is proving to be a great powder.

_________________
Cheers, Vince Cheers

Illegitimi non carborundum
(Never let the bastards grind you down)

Live simply. Love generously. Care deeply. Speak kindly. Leave the rest to God.

"Nulla Si Fa Senza Volonta."
(Without Commitment, Nothing Gets Done)
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English Mike
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Joined: Jan 08, 2007
Posts: 1167
Location: Whitehaven, Cumbria, UK

PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 3:41 pm    Post subject: Re: Tried & True Reply with quote

Aloysius wrote:
Last kg Vihtavuori N120 cost me about 100 euro and that was 2-3 weeks ago.

When things continue like this I think I have to take some lessons at Stovey's and learn how to shoot bow and arrows...


but SJ, you did it again. You pointed me at the fact that powder could damage my barrel. Till now only lead and copper made me fear.

Pretty much the same price here for VV N140 £80/$104/kg - roughly $47/lb.
It works very well out the 26" barrel on the AI & 75gr bullets.
I still persist with H4831 for the .270 & 130gr bullets, as it produces results that ensure a clean kill so long as I do my part (the component pulling the trigger is always the biggest variable).
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Aloysius
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Joined: Nov 03, 2009
Posts: 2076
Location: B., Belgium

PostPosted: Sat Oct 07, 2017 12:42 am    Post subject: Re: Tried & True Reply with quote

and powder is 1 thing, what about bullets? Recently I'm testing the 40 grs in the .22 Hornet and a .222 Rem. I paid for Sierra's 40 grs # 1385 this week 21,72 €/100 and for #1200 even 22,43 €/100.

beginning to understand Stovey's bow and arrow interests...
might be very interesting as soon as I learn my dog to retrieve arrows too Smile
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Elvis
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Joined: Jul 27, 2008
Posts: 7047
Location: south island New Zealand

PostPosted: Sat Oct 07, 2017 10:18 pm    Post subject: Re: Tried & True Reply with quote

just spent wet afternoon at mates place sorting out some sort of a load for his rifle..... beginning to dislike custom jobs its a .204ruger necked up to .224 (which to my mind has gone full circle and remade the 222 magnum)
ladder testing over chrony has reinforced just how much I dont need one.
trying to stoke her right up to get that last fps seems plurry pointless to me.

we settled on something below maximum and I will go from there. for all the mucking around the gains over std .223 was sweet stuff all in real world terms.
the extra 5grns of powder for maybe 200fps yeah nah not worth the hassle not to mention all the extra expense settling up the rifle to begin with.it will be interesting to see what its like on animals.
good part of the day was poking 3 loads out of .270
range was 150yards and due to wobbling I called a 4 " group and buggamesideways thats eggzachary what it was...good enough for this kiwi in the crap conditions. it will be on deer out to 250 which is long shot for me.

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Them who eats the most duck eats the most feathers!
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