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Why a Premium bullet?
Discussion regarding the reloading of ammunition and tuning of loads for accuracy
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Handloader
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 13, 2006 11:27 pm    Post subject: Re: Why a Premium bullet? Reply with quote

vandergrift wrote:
In my 40 years or so of handlonding and hunting, I have never found a so called premium bullet that was any where near as accurate as the standard Sierra, Horandy, and Speer spitzers. . . .

That, too, has been my experience in the past. Then along came the Barnes TSX and changed everything. Here is the premiere hunting bullet that has been as accurate or more accurate than any match grade bullet in my experience.

If any has a past history of fouling with the X bullet or lack of accuracy, the new TSX is certainly worthy of another try.
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POP!!
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2006 1:46 pm    Post subject: Re: Why a Premium bullet? Reply with quote

Handloader wrote:

That, too, has been my experience in the past. Then along came the Barnes TSX and changed everything. Here is the premiere hunting bullet that has been as accurate or more accurate than any match grade bullet in my experience.

If any has a past history of fouling with the X bullet or lack of accuracy, the new TSX is certainly worthy of another try.

I agree. My latest findings are .74" at 200 yds from my 300 Rum. 168 TSX's at 3500 fps . I can live with that!

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Coyote_Hunter_
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 10:12 pm    Post subject: Re: Why a Premium bullet? Reply with quote

vandergrift wrote:
In my 40 years or so of handlonding and hunting, I have never found a so called premium bullet that was any where near as accurate as the standard Sierra, Horandy, and Speer spitzers. ...

Year before last the North Fork 160g bullets shot a 0.266" group out of my 1981 7mm Mag. Best group I ever shot unil this last weekend when I managed a 0.232" 3-shot group with the .257 Roberts and A-MAX bullets.

Barnes TSX have done well by me, too.

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Flint54
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2006 3:27 am    Post subject: Re: Why a Premium bullet? Reply with quote

Shocked I don't know what many of you consider a "Premium" bullet as compaired to a "Standard" but I have found that the Nosler BT (which I consider a Premium) to be very accurate and in many cases it will outshoot even a "Match" bullet. There are numerous Match Shooters that use the Nosler 125gr BT out to 300 yards/meters due to its lower recoil and its unearing accuracy. I have weighed many boxes of bullets and have found that the Nosler BTs are one of the most consistant bullets on the market. Cool Many of the other "Premium" bullets do not have the ability to be as accurate due to the many variables inherent in their construction, ie. dual cores, steel cups, tungsten inserts etc. When you add these items and or steps in the construction you induce many areas that may have an effect on the accuracy of the bullet. Sad
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wirehunt
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2006 5:50 am    Post subject: Re: Why a Premium bullet? Reply with quote

I'm with you Flint, the Nosler BT is the bullet I reach for and have great success with.
In both my 7mm08 and when I had a 6.5x55 120gr Nosler and the animal is down, but then again a long shot for me is 300.
I don't like to see the bullet exiting the animal either, to me that's wasted energy. And I'm on a string of one shot kills, for me it's all about bullet placement. The longest a deer goes when hit with one of these is forty yards, but 9 times out of 10 it lays where it was shot.
If you put it in the wrong place it doesn't matter what size the bullet is the animal is going to go a long way.
I will happily use the 120 on Wapiti, but I won't shoot unless it's a clean killing shot.

Stephen

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Coyote_Hunter_
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2006 9:02 am    Post subject: Re: Why a Premium bullet? Reply with quote

Flint54 wrote:
8-O I don't know what many of you consider a "Premium" bullet as compaired to a "Standard" but I have found that the Nosler BT (which I consider a Premium) to be very accurate and in many cases it will outshoot even a "Match" bullet. There are numerous Match Shooters that use the Nosler 125gr BT out to 300 yards/meters due to its lower recoil and its unearing accuracy. I have weighed many boxes of bullets and have found that the Nosler BTs are one of the most consistant bullets on the market. Cool Many of the other "Premium" bullets do not have the ability to be as accurate due to the many variables inherent in their construction, ie. dual cores, steel cups, tungsten inserts etc. When you add these items and or steps in the construction you induce many areas that may have an effect on the accuracy of the bullet. Sad

Flint54 –

There are probably as many answers to the question of what constitutes “Premium” bullets as there are people who shoot them. Here’s my ideas of what differentiates them from standard bullets.

1. Bullet design that promotes high weight retention at all useful velocities (from the muzzle to way out there).
2. Bullet design that promotes reliable but controlled expansion.
3. Accuracy potential of 1MOA or better.

You will note that I did not include cost as a differentiating factor.


Weight retention can be accomplished by a number of, or a combination of, methods. Crossmembers (Partition, A-Frame, Failsafe, etc.), core bonding (InterBond, AccuBond, North Fork, Trophy Bonded, A-Frame, etc.), solid shanks (North Fork, Trophy Bonded, X, etc.), thicker jackets, dual cores (the older Grand Slams), and other methods have been tried and proven. With bullets that use a lead core up front, I pretty much consider bonding a requirement these days and have mentally assigned Partitions and Grand Slams to a “semi-premium” category.

Expansion must be reliable. My first experience with Barnes XLC’s was extremely disappointing and as a result I refuse to use them on anything but varmints and targets. At the same time expansion should be controlled. It isn’t uncommon to see pictures of bullets that have expanded right down to their base, or very close to it. Such bullets are not for me any more than bullets which cannot be counted on to expand at all. I believe there is a happy medium that will provide the best combination of penetration and destruction. IMHO, A-Frames, Trophy Bonded and North Fork are the best there is in this category. Barnes claims the new design and manufacturing tehniques for the TSX have solved expansion problems sometimes encountered with the X bullets, but I have no personal experience to prove it – even though I hunted with the TSX’s last fall.

Accuracy potential has never been a problem for me – it seems that every bullet I’ve tried will shoot just fine given the right load recipe. Speer Grand Slams were consistently 0.5MOA out of my 7mm Mag and 0.4MOA out of my buddy’s. Barnes XLC’s often shoot 3-shot, 2-hole groups under an inch. North Forks have provided me with the best accuracy I have ever achieved in a hunting rifle (3-shot group under one bullet diameter center-to-center). A-Frames and TSX and AccuBonds shoot very well in my .257 Roberts, TSX and North Forks do well in my .300 Win Mag, North Forks do well in my .45-70.

With larger diameter bullets expansion isn’t necessarily required. But that’s a separate discussion.

In the end it comes down to what works. Even though I handload I haven’t been able to match the Winchester 170g Power Point factory ammo in my Marlin .30-30. Not a problem, as at .30-30 velocities a standard “cup-and-core” bullet should do just fine.

At any rate, those are my thoughts. YMMV.

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BigBlue
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2006 9:27 pm    Post subject: Re: Why a Premium bullet? Reply with quote

Where I hunt, I come across deer at ranges anywhere from 30 yards out to 300 yards so I want a bullet that can handle either while giving good accuracy. Having just bought a 7mm Rem Mag, I picked Barnes 140gr. XLC-BT and Nosler 160gr. Accu-bond bullets. I want to know that if I get a less than a desireable angle on a shot, that the bullet will have what it takes to penetrate deep enough. I also want to get the most velocity possible in a hunting cartridge, not have to cut velocity down to accomidate a bullet that can't handle it. While I get great accuracy from Sierra Game Kings and Nosler BT bullets from most rifles, I don't think they can handle high velocity close range hits. Most companies will give you a recommended velocity range for their bullets and if I remember correctly nosler BT's are listed for under 3000FPS. I think all of this is much less of a concern when your talking about a bullet that's traveling at muzzle velocities under 2500 FPS.
Don
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Flint54
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2006 5:33 pm    Post subject: Re: Why a Premium bullet? Reply with quote

Cool I agree with you all, my criteria may be a bit more demanding as I will more than likely be out armed with my 14" Contender in .308 Bellm. With this firearm and a 150gr bullet I will be able to reach a max velocity of just over 2350 fps. Expansion is extreemely important as is penetration. With light skinned game this is no problem with a 150 the only problem is that the BT has IMO failed on 1 occation leaving only a 70gr piece on a 30 yard kill and did not pass through. At 50 yards + I have never recovered a bullet, all complete pass throughs. Just looking for the ultimate bullet. Cool
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BigBlue
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2006 5:50 pm    Post subject: Re: Why a Premium bullet? Reply with quote

Barnes Bullets announced a new bullet design called the MRX.. They are due out in the Spring in some calibers. Their X bullets have always held up and worked well, I wonder how well these will do?
Don
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