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515034s10ring Super Member
Joined: Sep 08, 2005 Posts: 1153 Location: Working my way back up and around
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Posted: Tue Sep 27, 2005 9:43 am Post subject: Entrapment????? |
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With the recent Crane posting it made me think about how one year the DNR and County LEO's took poacher's off the street.
Now 14 years ago when i was scouting on some state land i had found a nice spot along a half cut corn field, with high traffic to hunt. It was pretty remote but with no access to from the main road (which was in sight), and really hard to get to from the back road so i decided to put up my stand and come back every couple of days to check on it and make sure everything was still ok.
Just as bow season was starting i noticed a 'mechanical' 8 pt. deer around 150 yards directly infront of my stand and bait pile with it's tail flipping up, and even on a short track to make it move! So i thought someone moved in closely to my area and figured now that opening day was two day's away i'm not changing so i stayed.
Opening day i had quickly shot a big doe so i took that home and got ready for a few bucks i had seen come into the area. About a week later, i still saw nobody around the mechanical deer but it had helped me because every couple of days a nice 8 pointer would come over to check it out, then come over to my 100 yard bait pile, but the wind was not in my favor those days so i had to pass.
Then, Sunday Oct 13 1991, i had gotten to my stand a few hours early and noticed a few people near the mechanical deer then quickly take off? An hour later i saw a spot light from the road, and with just enough light to see with my binoculars,(and driving under a street light) i saw a white and blue truck on the road that was shining a spotlight into the corn field and then stop. The three guys in the truck were shining the mechanical deer and shot it with their rifle, getting a direct hit on the mechanical deer and shot twice more. After realizing it was fake they hurried and 'TRIED' to get out but were now approached by gun point, and by DNR and LEO vehicles.
After these guys were arrested only minutes later when i was getting out of my stand to tell them what i had seen, as soon as i got down i looked up and two of the CO's walking toward me and asked me if i had seen anything. Of course i said everything so they took my statement and later i had found out all three were involved in poaching for a few years so they set up the mechanical deer in my area because it was the hardest hit. All three were cought with 'freezers' full venison as well! Ultimately they were charged with:
Poaching, Illeagal discharge of a firearm, Hunting before hours, Illeagal discharge of firearm durring bow season, reckless and human endangerment, and so on (because i forget all the charges). But their sentences were upto 20 years in prison and their lawyers got it down to 3 years in prison, $50,000 each in restitution and ten year suspention of sportsman privileges. The funny thing is that the local paper just listed it as "Poachers Caught and Arrested" and had a short 3 sentence article.
So what do you guy's think, was it entrapment? I really don't think so,
but i do think they got what they deserve!
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DallanC Site Admin
Joined: Jan 18, 2005 Posts: 3571 Location: Utah
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Posted: Tue Sep 27, 2005 10:57 am Post subject: Re: Entrapment????? |
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No I dont view this as entrapment per say. Its a good tool to catch those who poach.
-DallanC
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tbox61 Member
Joined: Aug 31, 2005 Posts: 76 Location: Great Bend, KS
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Posted: Tue Sep 27, 2005 11:04 am Post subject: Re: Entrapment????? |
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10ring,
I agree with you, not entrapment, but gets the unethical slobs out of the picture. Here in Kansas, the use the RoboDeer, (that's what they call it), just as you described it. It is always used on private land, with the permission of the landowner, to discourage road hunting and hunting without permission.
This is a non-issue for ethical hunters. My nephew is a CO in Missouri, and prior to that was a CO here in Kansas. I don't believe he draws his firearm when approaching the would-be poachers. He videos the goings on, and most of the time he says that the people are embarrassed and feel very stupid when caught.
If this keeps a poacher from taking a trophy whitetail buck illegally, thus depriving you and I from taking it fair chase, I am all for it!
Tim
_________________ There are 2 theories to arguing with a woman...neither works.
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shrpshtrjoe Super Red Neck Member
Joined: Jan 26, 2005 Posts: 2965 Location: Maryland
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515034s10ring Super Member
Joined: Sep 08, 2005 Posts: 1153 Location: Working my way back up and around
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shrpshtrjoe Super Red Neck Member
Joined: Jan 26, 2005 Posts: 2965 Location: Maryland
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Posted: Tue Sep 27, 2005 2:06 pm Post subject: Re: Entrapment????? |
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_________________ "MOLON LABE"
P E T A
People Eating Tasty Animals |
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Handloader Super Member
Joined: Aug 22, 2005 Posts: 1032 Location: Phoenix, Arizona
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Posted: Tue Sep 27, 2005 2:18 pm Post subject: Re: Entrapment????? |
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We have female police officers posing as prostitutes, undercover guys setting up drug buys, decoy cars with keys left in the ignition and photo radar at intersections for red light runners. Some nearby communities use photo radar for speeders. I see it in the same light as the robodeer and support the use of each and every one of these methods and candidly I don't care if it is entrapment or not.
Other societies have more carefully defined mores about individual discretion. I recall loosing my wallet in a "3rd World" country. It had over $400 US and about half that in local currency. In total, it represented about a three month income for most people in that area. When I returned about an hour later to the restaurant where I presumed I had lost it, it was sitting in plain view on the counter. All the money was there. It was found by another customer that had given it to the waitress. And, no, she wouldn't take a reward.
In Phoenix we lock our doors. Car doors, home doors, fence gates, business doors. Yet, I have lived in some areas of our country where people leave routinely the keys in their cars, the homes unlocked and burglar alarms are rare. Which is one more reason I will leave this big Valley as soon as practical.
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515034s10ring Super Member
Joined: Sep 08, 2005 Posts: 1153 Location: Working my way back up and around
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Posted: Tue Sep 27, 2005 2:24 pm Post subject: Re: Entrapment????? |
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515034s10ring Super Member
Joined: Sep 08, 2005 Posts: 1153 Location: Working my way back up and around
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Posted: Tue Sep 27, 2005 2:45 pm Post subject: Re: Entrapment????? |
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Handloader wrote: |
In Phoenix we lock our doors. Car doors, home doors, fence gates, business doors. Yet, I have lived in some areas of our country where people leave routinely the keys in their cars, the homes unlocked and burglar alarms are rare. Which is one more reason I will leave this big Valley as soon as practical. |
That is a very good point because i 'used' to live in an apartment that was in a good area, which we all would do for one another and the workers were cool to, but we locked everything up still. Until my apartment was broken into and i used a method to stop an imminent threat and they tried charging me for repairs. Then i was told i "HAD" to move because of some clause in the lease that 'illeagal' explosives were not permitted on the premises as is the storage of firearms. To bad none of my weapons were 'illeagal'!
But all came out good because the managers and holding company had to pay for my move and eat the early termination of my lease as well as pay for legal fees, for in my lease agreement it stated "we shall provide a quiet, safe and well lit enviroment" and safe would then be classified as 'having on grounds security' in this case, which they didn't. Some lawyers are good.
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Gil Martin Super Member
Joined: Jan 28, 2005 Posts: 1837 Location: Schnecksville, PA
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Posted: Tue Sep 27, 2005 3:40 pm Post subject: Re: Entrapment????? |
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Nope, not entrapment. I have to ask, was the mechanical deer a total loss? All the best...
Gil
_________________ Gil |
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515034s10ring Super Member
Joined: Sep 08, 2005 Posts: 1153 Location: Working my way back up and around
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Posted: Tue Sep 27, 2005 4:01 pm Post subject: Re: Entrapment????? |
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A few dents, no through shots so i'd believe it's plate steel.
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GroovyJack Member
Joined: May 21, 2005 Posts: 621 Location: Bama
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Posted: Tue Sep 27, 2005 7:24 pm Post subject: Re: Entrapment????? |
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No entrapment , I dont believe .. If it gets rid of the trash then so be it .. We are lucky in that all the game wardens I know and have dealings with are good people , not out to try to get you ..
They know there is good and bad , but , I have seen some who think all are bad ..
Jack
_________________ My Goal In Life Is To Be As Good Of A Person As My Dog Already Thinks I Am |
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mikekuzara Member
Joined: Sep 13, 2005 Posts: 147 Location: Farson, Wyoming
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Posted: Tue Sep 27, 2005 7:59 pm Post subject: Re: Entrapment????? |
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Entrapment would be an under cover game warden sitting in the truck and encouraging the poacher to take the shot, after driving him there.
Shooting at what they thought was a real deer on property they did not have acces to , is like saying that if someone walks into your backyard and takes your lawn furniture, it was entrapment. They had no legal right to be where they were, doing what they were doing. i just wish all states had the confiscation laws Wyoming has. These guys would have lost their spotlight, guns, and truck on top of everything else.
_________________ Build a fire for a man and he is warm for a day.
Set a man on fire and he is warm the rest of his life. |
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Flint54 Member
Joined: Apr 09, 2005 Posts: 389 Location: North Carolina
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Posted: Tue Sep 27, 2005 8:39 pm Post subject: Re: Entrapment????? |
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grimel Member
Joined: Jan 28, 2005 Posts: 160
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Posted: Wed Sep 28, 2005 12:49 am Post subject: Re: Entrapment????? |
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Entrapment? Let me put it this way, the TN specific deer hunting board I play on has bought 3 robo deer for TWRA to help catch the $*% $%*& #$(**# poachers.
_________________ But.....ain't many troubles that a man caint fix
with seven hundred dollars and his thirty ought six.
Lindy Cooper Wisdom
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