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Please, stop with the "tactical"
Discussion that doesnt fit other Topics
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Handloader
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Joined: Aug 22, 2005
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Location: Phoenix, Arizona

PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2006 10:47 pm    Post subject: Please, stop with the "tactical" Reply with quote

Some years ago it was decided that the word "tactical" had some magical powers to sell items. Soon we saw every other article refer to some aspect of the firearm under discussion as have "tactical" properties. This was about the time that no handgun could ever be photographed without some sort of upscale knife in the picture as well.

Much of the firearms industry runs on hype, but, at some point the hype becomes far too transparent. I, for one, am tired of anything being described as tactical as well as the photos of knives to compliment some firearm.

And, that's my rant. Thank you, I feel better now.
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Vince
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2006 11:25 pm    Post subject: Re: Please, stop with the "tactical" Reply with quote

Ok Handloader...I am with you....well said.
One other thing that annoys eleven sorts of crap out of me is calling firearms WEAPONS !!!! I suppose one could argue that they are a weapon of sorts, but the connotations that are attached to something called a weapon are bad. I mean a rock could be classified as a weapon but is never referred to as such, why then a firearm????

I think that firearm owners need to take some of the responsibility for this, especially the SOF wannabes. If we all made a conscious effort to refer to our FIREARMS and not our weapons then I think that it would go a long way towards hopefully changing at least some of the public attitudes towards firearms owners. Might even take away some of the garbage the gun grabbers rely on to disarm the average man or woman.

OK, thats it, I'm off my soapbox. Rant

Cheers, Vince

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Dimitri
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2006 7:50 am    Post subject: Re: Please, stop with the "tactical" Reply with quote

If it has the word "Tactical" or is refered using that word I wont look at the firearm/accessory myself. Very Happy

Tactical "products" have no real benifit in alot of ways compared to "non-tactical" products execpt to make someones pocket empty faster. Sad

You know the moment they brand something "tactical" or they show a gun with a "knife" that is also "tactical" its really to appeal to the Mall-ninjas types (and people that act like them less the insane mall security part), you know the type, abit bigger in the waistline guys that never got out of the teenage stage, they want the latest and greatest to "protect" people in malls and threaten that they will attack anyone that comes into a mall with a firearm. Or Gun store Commando's (This is another story though). Mad They'll spend all there lunch money on the best they can afford just to try and win the "mine is better then yours contest".

If you want to learn more about these:

sigforum.com/groupee/f...103883/p/1

Back up of Originals:
www.geocities.com/suke...ninja.html

The Original Mall Ninja Gecko_45
Quote::
It's okay for me to talk about my job, as long as I'm not specific. I am the Sergeant of a three-man Rapid Tactical Force at one of America's largest indoor retail shopping areas. Although there are typically between fifteen and twenty normal security officers working the beat there, we decided a while ago that it would be best to have a specilized force for violent individuals. We use modified electric vehicles and can be anywhere on a given floor within eight and a half minutes.

Naturally, the regular security people are unarmed. We "RTFers", by arrangement with the local police, carry high-strength OC spray and batons. If we have a full tactical alert and permission from the local LEOs we also have a Mossberg 500 with less-lethal rounds and two K-frame Smith .38s loaded with 158gr. LRN.

Basically, the situation is that we get the call, we lock up the situation, put everything five by five, and cordon the area until the local authorities arrive. We're cops, we just don't get the glory.

I am not permitted to carry Glocks on duty; however, when my wife picks me up from work I strap on the "Deadly Duo" of a 27 and 23, each with Bar-Sto .357 bbl.

Dimitri

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mikekuzara
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2006 1:52 pm    Post subject: Re: Please, stop with the "tactical" Reply with quote

This reminds me of a guy who lived in our block. He was bragging one day that he never "took the same way home from work". My wife and I both looked at him in puzzlement, trying to figure out what reason a 5 foot 6 inch, 275 pound, pot bellied, wal mart employee could have for such behavior.

He further explained that it was because he guessed that he "had too much cop in me"

My wife patted his substantial gut and said, "why, did you eat one?"

He stopped talking to us after that, thank goodness.

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squirrelbait
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2006 7:32 am    Post subject: Re: Please, stop with the "tactical" Reply with quote

mikeKuzara, could you please give your wife a big hug for me. That is absolutely great.
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Gil Martin
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Location: Schnecksville, PA

PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2006 4:39 pm    Post subject: Re: Please, stop with the "tactical" Reply with quote

I agree. Every handgun and rifle article seems to reek of "tactical" something or other at a cost that equals the national debt. Who can afford those prices? I suspect the guy that wrote the article got the "tactical" stuff free for his hype. The gun shops that I visit do not hawk "tactical" crap.

Put me in the traditional column and let's move on. All the best...
Gil

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sniper
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2006 10:38 pm    Post subject: Re: Please, stop with the "tactical" Reply with quote

mikekuzara wrote:
He further explained that it was because he guessed that he "had too much cop in me" My wife patted his substantial gut and said, "why, did you eat one?"
ROFL

That's TOO funny! Very Happy

Unfortunately, we seem to have developed a "pseudo macho" element, that is fascinated with firearms, and the other accoutrements of "manliness", like camo clothing, knives and flashlights. Many are military or police wannabees, and some are ex military.

The tricked out M-16 look alikes, folding and fixed blade knives lights and "tactical" clothing all have utility, but more is spent by civilians on those things than by a lot of agencies. Shocked

I don't see a real civilian market developing for bullet resistant vests, though. Not visible enough, or don't look high tech enough, I suppose.

Fortunately, we live in a country where, if you qualify, and have enough money, you can have just about anything you can imagine, and varying opinions are acceptable.

I LIKE the M1A, the H&K G3 and MP5, Colt 1911 clones, and M4s . If I had the $$$, I'd have several.

If the firearm question could EVER be argued with facts and logic, it would become a non-event 30 seconds after the first debate.

But, facts and logic have been replaced with "feelings", reality has been replaced by perception, and truth has been replaced by the definition of "is". The GOOD news is, there are more reasonable, intelligent people (us) than there are of them. They just make more noise. That's why we need to become educated and involved.

Until the time comes when reasonable people can legally own and responsibly use whatever implement they choose to , without incurring unthinking wrathful attention, low profile is the best policy. Sure, we wear camo clothing, carry guns, and knives, find military equipment useful , and do terrible things to those sweet, innocent little animals, but that doesn't make us all bad...does it? Wink
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Jack
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2006 7:53 am    Post subject: Re: Please, stop with the "tactical" Reply with quote

Handloader, I sure agree with you!
Labeling something 'tactical' these days seems to appeal to some people, but it makes me avoid a product.
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515034s10ring
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2006 3:42 pm    Post subject: Re: Please, stop with the "tactical" Reply with quote

Tactical now, is in many ways either color or shape....which does not make it better than anything else. Unless you get "tactical" Military or Police issue Very Happy

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Dimitri
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2006 4:21 pm    Post subject: Re: Please, stop with the "tactical" Reply with quote

I wont buy something that even hints at the word tactical does that make me alittle to extreme ?? Confused Very Happy

This reminds me of paintballing as a situation. We had this one guy with atleast 2000$ in his gun and another 500$ in his clothing and vest. He acted so cool and he was trying to show off his "machoness". wtf

Took my brother about 2 minutes to kill him with no fancy black SWAT clothing and a rental paintball gun not a 2000$ gun to put one right where it counted .... right in his air ports in his mask ROFL

Dimitri

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GroovyJack
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2006 10:00 pm    Post subject: Re: Please, stop with the "tactical" Reply with quote

Yeah these people get me ... Yeah I remember when those pictures starting coming out .... They slipped 'em in on us easy like ..
Started out with a beautiful muzzleloader with a period knife , and was tasteful , not tactical ..
We have a place here that is called " Tactical Supply " , complete with the new crew cab diesel 4WD , and custom paint job that matches the price of the truck , dare 'em to put it on a dirt road ..
The ones that I laff ( cringe ) at are the ones wearing camo , with a mastadon skinner hanging off their belts .. Trying to look macho with all that , but if they only knew how silly they looked .. And they all seem to be around 5"6" and 275 pounds ..
HHMM may have to start a thread on my pet peeves ..
Jack

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Dimitri
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2006 5:09 pm    Post subject: Re: Please, stop with the "tactical" Reply with quote

This is a Mall Ninja fantasy he posted on a firearms board a while back:

Quote::
On this particular fateful day my team was assigned to patrol Sector Zebra-1, the mall. It was an uneventful day, until the unthinkable happened...

It was about 8:45PM, and the mall was closing and nearly empty. Me and my 'shadow' were sweeping quadrant 069E, the mall arcade, a known hotspot for Asian Gangs and assorted thugs. The arcade was located at the far east end of the mall, next to the movie theater and the orange julius.

I smelled trouble, and couldn't spot any movement from the arcade, which was unusual due to the presence of a new Mortal Combat arcade game. Those Asians Gangs love Mortal Combat.

I went to 'condition red,' and discretely unholstered my Glock 17 loaded with Black Talons. I motioned to my partner to sweep right to flank the arcade, but he was already in motion sensing the trouble in my facial expression. My partner drew his S&W 1006 and went prone behind a potted palm tree.

I crept towards the arcade, when the power went out. It was an ambush! I could still see relatively well due to the full moon, shining through the building's skylights, and years in a dark secret Russian prison center had honed my natural night vision to that of a tomcat.

A perp popped up from behind the Orange Julius counter with a full auto Kalashnikov with a 75rd drum, and opened up in the direction of my partner, meanwhile two perps popped up from behind the skeeball machine with sawed off 12 gauges. Another two perps appeared on the upper level and brought down hell-fire on us from above. One had a Winchester Model 70 in .30-06 with a 10x scope and the other was laying down suppressive fire with a Mac10 variant. The perps were all sporting cheap russian NVGs.

I dove under a metal bench, and lined my sights on the AK bandit. A double-tap to the chest, and a quick follow-up to the head brought him down like a sack of potatos. My partner had been hit in the leg by some buckshot but he kept fighting like a champ, he took out one of the shotgunners with a 10mm hollowpoint to the temple, while I started unloading into the glass partition that surrounded the upper level. When the sniper ran for cover I drew a bead on him, adjusted for distance, and dropped two into his abdomen. The Mac-man ran for it, at the sight of the bloody guts pouring out his partner's stomach.

I did a quick tactical reload, grabbed the 870P from the harness on my back, and did some rolls over to the movie theater and back flipped over the concession counter while unloading the 5 rounds of 000 into the skeeball machine. My partner was pinned down, I tossed the empty 870, and realized I couldn't hit the remaining perp due to my the poor angle of attack. I had to act fast or my partner was done for. I leapt over the counter again, and low crawled towards the arcade unseen. I crept behind the Mrs. PacMan game, and when I heard the perp reload, jumped up with my trusty K-Bar, and threw it into the perp's arm, pinning him against the wall behind him.

When the smoke cleared, we had three dead perps, and two very scared prisoners. My partner was slighting wounded but he would live to fight another day. The company goons came in fast by chopper, to cover up the situation. The remaining perps were flown to a company detention center, and we never found out what happened to them, or why they made such a vicious attack. My belief is that they were planning to hijack the coveted Mortal Combat game unit.

The remaining customers and employees were paid off to cover their emotional distress and to keep their mouths shut. Later an unknown shadowy figure in an expensive black suit (obviously a high ranking company guy) came to me as I was reloading my Rem870 (in case of a second wave of attackers) and offered me the job opportunity of a lifetime...

I don't know if I made the right decision that day. I will always fondly remember the days of mall security, the expressions on the thankful patrons you saved from certain molestation in the mall bathrooms. And the look of pain in the drooling face of the shoplifter you just choke-holded to unconciousness.

A Gunstore commando is someone that:

Quote::
Semi circular scar cutting thru the unibrow.
Camo Skivvies.
Wears full Camo BDUs or BDU paints and a really old Special Forces teeshirt
May own a black rifle, but you cant tell due to all the junk hanging over/under/round it.
Mil spec badges from every unit they wished they'd served in.
Constantly repeats the phrase" But they'd kill me if'n I tol' ya more"
Refers to upstate NY (like White Plains) as "In Country"
Has no pasters, 'cause he cant hit sh1t at 25 yds. ' cause he fires from the hip while yelling "$#@%&*^%$##@" at the range.
I got to add annoys people at gunstores because they belive they know everything about firearms when they dont.

A Mall ninja:
To give credit where its due his name is Spacemanspiff.


A Gunstore commando:

And his name is IZinterrogator.

Grovy I think you dealt with a gunstore commando myself. Donno though seems like it though Smile

Dimitri

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Vince
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2006 8:22 pm    Post subject: Re: Please, stop with the "tactical" Reply with quote

Hey ya Dimtri.....damn....are these CLOWNS for real?????? They wouldn't last 5 minutes in Australia.....they would be laughed out of the country, and if they were silly enough to get snarly.....well, 'nough said I think.

Cheers, Vince

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Live simply. Love generously. Care deeply. Speak kindly. Leave the rest to God.

"Nulla Si Fa Senza Volonta."
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Bushmaster
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2006 8:31 pm    Post subject: Re: Please, stop with the "tactical" Reply with quote

Note "tongue out" tenny runners and a pot belly on the first one...What a laugh...

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1895ss
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2006 8:33 pm    Post subject: Re: Please, stop with the "tactical" Reply with quote

Yep he's all ninja.......... wannabe Very Happy

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