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dhc4ever Super Member
Joined: May 26, 2011 Posts: 2944 Location: Ipswich, Queensland Australia
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Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2011 8:53 pm Post subject: Powder speed |
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How do you know if the powder you are using is too slow?
I'm currently using ADI 2213sc in a 25/06, but Im not quite satisified with the results.
Thoughts, tips, experiences, over to you.
_________________ Pete
Dont do anything you wont like explaining to the paramedics.............. |
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Ominivision1 Super Member
Joined: Sep 20, 2010 Posts: 2984 Location: Iowa
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Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2011 11:38 pm Post subject: Re: Powder speed |
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I tried H4831 in my 25-06 and was not satisfied with the accuracy. I went with varget which is a faster burning rate powder.
The first thing to understand is that we have two limits: cartridge case volume and
maximum chamber pressure! Therefore the powder with the ideal burn rate is
the one that intersects the closet to the intersection of the max volume limit and the max pressure limit!
That is achieving chamber pressure limit with the cartridge case filled to capacity Limit
with loading powder; packing and extracting the maximum chemical energy you can with in the
two limits (pressure & case volume)!
If you use a powder that has a burn rate that's faster than ideal, then you'll fall short of filling the case's entire volume without exceeding the chamber's max
pressure! You'll only get maximum chemical energy in a cartridge when you fill
the entire case volume!
Now if you use a powder with a burn rate slower than ideal, you'll easily be able to
fill the cartridge's entire case volume, but you won't be able to extract all the available chemical energy from your powder charge!
In both of the above scenarios, your muzzle velocities will be below what you
could achieve with a powder of the ideal burn rate!
Usually you can identify the ideal powder in the loading manual by looking for
the powder in the column of the highest velocity with the lowest powder charge
weight! Logic says to go with the one of the highest charge in the max velocity
column, but the actual velocities tend to be lower than published velocities, so you'll
need a little extra available internal room within the cartridge to ad a little extra
to the published powder charge!
_________________ Regards
Limitations are but boundaries created inside our minds. |
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Vince Site Admin
Joined: May 25, 2005 Posts: 15715 Location: Brisbane AUSTRALIA
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Ominivision1 Super Member
Joined: Sep 20, 2010 Posts: 2984 Location: Iowa
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Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2011 4:02 am Post subject: Re: Powder speed |
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Here is a burn rate chart that has over 260 powders. Burn Rate Chart
_________________ Regards
Limitations are but boundaries created inside our minds. |
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Pumpkinslinger Super Member
Joined: Sep 22, 2007 Posts: 5002 Location: NC foothills
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Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2011 4:35 am Post subject: Re: Powder speed |
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Vince wrote: |
... look at reloading data...never try to cook up a load using guesswork data...too dangerous. |
I agree 110% (yes, one hundred ten percent!) with Vince. My "method" for a new load is to pick the bullet I want to use, based on use, then look at the load data for that bullet. I pick a powder that gives the highest velocity and, if possible, lowest pressure. Then work up your load with that powder.
_________________ Mike
"I ain't no better than anybody else, and there ain't nobody better than me!" Ma Kettle |
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Bushmaster Super Member
Joined: Jun 12, 2005 Posts: 11393 Location: Ava, Missouri
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Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2011 6:30 am Post subject: Re: Powder speed |
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Vince and Pumpkinslinger have it. Though Pumpkinslinger just simplified it.
ByTheWay...H4831 and H4831SC is better used with heavier bullets. 165 grain and up.
_________________ I have one nerve left and yer standin' on it...
DEMOCRACY Two wolves and one sheep voting on what to have for lunch...
LIBERTY A well armed sheep contesting the outcome of the vote... |
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English Mike Super Member
Joined: Jan 08, 2007 Posts: 1709 Location: Whitehaven, Cumbria, UK
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Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2011 11:00 am Post subject: Re: Powder speed |
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H4831 and H4831SC are great powders behind a 130gr bullet in .270 Winchester too.
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dhc4ever Super Member
Joined: May 26, 2011 Posts: 2944 Location: Ipswich, Queensland Australia
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Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2011 2:21 pm Post subject: Re: Powder speed |
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OV1,
What weight projectiles are you using the Varget with?
I was toying with the idea when I've finished the new bottle of 2213sc of going up in burning rate to AR 2209, I hadnt considered AR 2208 (varget) but I am now.
Nozler 115gr Btips are the projectiles I'm attempting to devise a consistent accurate load for.
Vince,
The 2213sc does seem to fill the case quite well between the 48 and 52grn limits its sitting into the shoulder area.
Pumpkinslinger,
That makes sense, unfortunately the ADI loading data doesn't list pressures.
Bushy, Englishmike,
120 - 125grn is the limit in the 25/06, which is one of the reasons I'm wondering if AR2213sc is too slow for the weight of projectiles I'm using.
Keep the info comming
Cheers guys
_________________ Pete
Dont do anything you wont like explaining to the paramedics.............. |
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Ominivision1 Super Member
Joined: Sep 20, 2010 Posts: 2984 Location: Iowa
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Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2011 3:07 pm Post subject: Re: Powder speed |
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I shoot with my 25/06 with an 85gr Nosler BT using Varget at 42grs with OAL at 3.225". This load for my rifle gives me the best with accuracy. If I do my part I can print them at less than 1" at 100yards.
_________________ Regards
Limitations are but boundaries created inside our minds. |
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1895ss Super Member
Joined: Jul 21, 2005 Posts: 2612 Location: Not Here...!!
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Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2011 8:30 pm Post subject: Re: Powder speed |
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Try some IMR 7828, works great for me in my 25-06, at max load.
_________________ A cruel truth is much more desirable than a really nice lie.
'Tis far better to walk alone than to follow a crowd or an a**hole going the wrong way. |
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