ELK SHOT AND RAVAGED BY POACHER

fireball 3 · Posted: Sun Nov 23, 2008 10:51 pm Post subject: ELK SHOT AND RAVAGED BY POACHER

This story makes me mad and sick....

www.redding.com/news/2...-bull-elk/

Handloader

Follow some of the comments on the story off the same site. Interesting.

It would be offensive enough if this was a singular case, but, regretably, it is not. Poaching is on the rise. Drawing a tag is more difficult and the competition for them will only increase. Game and Fish management becomes conflicted when budgets are based, in part, on tag fees and appointees to the the game and fish boards subject to far too much political consideration. Public land hunting becomes increasingly restricted and the advent of land holder tags sold to the highest bidder distort the entire concept of fair chase hunting and equal access. In many cases, the fine for poaching can be LESS than the cost of a landholder tag or out of state license and tag. So, what does the future hold?

On one level there may an effort to establish federal game management that superceeds state oversight. This could happen under an Obama and liberal congress. Hunting has become increasingly an activity that could fall under the purview of Interstate Commerce and that aspect has been argued most recently with US Outfitters vs Arizona. USO was upheld initially by the 9th Circuit. It was later overturned, but, by narrow margin.

Poaching is decimating many hunting areas in Arizona, along with the reintroduction of wolves. Illegal immigrants have no qualms about roasting a javelina, deer or big horn sheep as they roam our SW deserts. Little enforcement is noted for poachers or illegals, yet, the penalty for poaching a wolf is actually greater than for pedophilia in Arizona!! So, we have a major value conflict it seems.

Solutions? Ideas? Suggestions?

Bushmaster

Oregon and Washington must be unique when it comes to fining poachers. They loose their rifles, vehicles and trailers used in the poaching and a stiff fine...

Most states tend to people manage rather then to game manage and as long as we allow liberals to work for the game commission we will continue to have people managment of our game.

With the bad econimy and the lost jobs we will definately see a real rise in poaching.

Solution? Here I draw a blank until we get "real game managers" on the job...

skb2706 · Member Joined: Apr 10, 2006 Posts: 269

Watched as two fellas shot and killed a cow elk just three weeks ago. Jumped out of their truck on the highway, busted off two shots, killed at least one cow elk and drove away. They were too far away for me to do anything from the top of the mountain I was on. I did report it to the landowner who in turn reported it to the DOW, never found out who did it but they had been seen around the area before.

Weinbender

Around my parts penaltys for poachers are very harsh and better so.
Loose ur hunting license therefore ur firearms, might get ur drivers taken away therefore ur vehicle and u can be put to prison for a minimum of 5 years and up to $10,000 fine!

now thats what i call a fine!!!

Dan

TRBLSHTR

Bushy- another thing to add for Oregon-last I heard that poaching of an elk can get you loss of any and all equipment involved in hunt to include vehicles,camping supplies, firearms,etc.,and loss of hunting rights for up to ten years as well as a stiff fine!Not quite so much for deer.Have'nt heard of the fines for wolves in oregon yet-but in Idaho you'd be better off comitting murder than shooting one of their"darling doggies"!Pretty pitiful when taxpayers pay on avg $100k dollars to have each of these damn things,for them to be imported from canada.

SwampFox

Handloader, Arizona has some damned strange laws and processes when it comes to the welfare of children. It is a zoo and the animals are in charge, in my opinion.
Best,
Ed

Dimitri · Super Member Joined: Nov 25, 2005 Posts: 5944

Is it wrong of me I am more ticked that they left the carcass to rot then the poaching?

I mean if they took it all home and actually ate it. I would be less bothered about it personally.

Weinbender wrote:

Loose ur hunting license therefore ur firearms

No you lose your PAL Garrenteed from poaching. Anything on your criminal record (not your driving record, however DUIs can count however) will have your ability to legally own firearms revoked forever. As for the hunting license, normally suspended for 10 years to forever.

In Ontario a basic offense is $25,000 and/or 1 year imprisonment. Can go much higher then that as each offense is added on and some offenses are more then this "starting" line.

Dimitri

shrpshtrjoe

Dimitri wrote:

Is it wrong of me I am more ticked that they left the carcass to rot then the poaching?

I mean if they took it all home and actually ate it. I would be less bothered about it personally.
Dimitri

I kinda feel the same way Dimitri. Wrong is wrong but that's adding insult to injury Mad

Joe

Weinbender

Dimitri wrote:

Is it wrong of me I am more ticked that they left the carcass to rot then the poaching?

I mean if they took it all home and actually ate it. I would be less bothered about it personally.

Weinbender wrote:

Loose ur hunting license therefore ur firearms

No you lose your PAL Garrenteed from poaching. Anything on your criminal record (not your driving record, however DUIs can count however) will have your ability to legally own firearms revoked forever. As for the hunting license, normally suspended for 10 years to forever.

In Ontario a basic offense is $25,000 and/or 1 year imprisonment. Can go much higher then that as each offense is added on and some offenses are more then this "starting" line.

Dimitri

Thanks Big D,
i didnt do much research, i just heard something along those lines from
a game warden.

My dad and i often go walk the prairies around here, check out nesting places from Canada geese(note: we dont get close or actually thouch it)
and we noticed once that one nest was all rustled up and we found the dead gander and his companion dead, probably fought to the death with the fox. Most of the chicks were dead but by some chance we found 2 still alive. We took them home, made a little pond for them and fed them what real geese for eat. Well someone ratted us out and the Game Warden came, we explained to him what and why and he was understanding.
And i swear that since then ive seen every year anew 2 geese flying circles above our house honking!!

Dan

Dimitri · Super Member Joined: Nov 25, 2005 Posts: 5944

Weinbender wrote:

Most of the chicks were dead but by some chance we found 2 still alive. We took them home, made a little pond for them and fed them what real geese for eat. Well someone ratted us out and the Game Warden came, we explained to him what and why and he was understanding

Shame isn't it when you can get charged for taking in wildlife that would have died otherwise.

I may be able to go hunting, I may be able to kill animals for food, but I still would help a youngin to survive if they would not naturally.

Funny thing is there was a article about Animal rights activists in the news paper a couple years back, and with the use of hard numbers (money and time wise) it went on to say the biggest supporters of wildlife was actually hunters and fishermen who donated money and their time to preserve our wildlife not "animal lovers".

Dimitri

Weinbender

Quote::

Shame isn't it when you can get charged for taking in wildlife that would have died otherwise.

I may be able to go hunting, I may be able to kill animals for food, but I still would help a youngin to survive if they would not naturally.

Funny thing is there was a article about Animal rights activists in the news paper a couple years back, and with the use of hard numbers (money and time wise) it went on to say the biggest supporters of wildlife was actually hunters and fishermen who donated money and their time to preserve our wildlife not "animal lovers".

Dimitri

Excactly my thoughts Big D, i feel exactly like u do when it comes to injured animals, i cant stand to see an animal suffer. Thats why i always try to shoot to kill.

And ill be darned if i dont try to save a deer/rabbit/geese or whatever it might be.

Dan

Vince

'Mitri wrote:

Shame isn't it when you can get charged for taking in wildlife that would have died otherwise.

Out here in Australia (well certainly Queensland where I live) we have volunteer Wildlife Carers who take in injured/sick wildlife...usually native wildlife...and do their best to nurse them back to health for release back into the wild.

They are Government supported, but unpaid, and make themselves available usually 24 hrs a day for the care of wildlfe. A Wildlife Carer will specify the type of wildlife they want to help...usually a type they understand or have experience with, ie birds or possums or bats or kangaroos or koalas...then when somone calls the National Parks and Wildlife Department with an injured or sick animal they are referred to a Carer in their area.

They do a great job.

Cheers, Vince

Dimitri · Super Member Joined: Nov 25, 2005 Posts: 5944

We have some in a limited way in the way of Shelters, however just the act of removing the animal from the wild without special permission is the reason you can get charged here. Sad

Edit, to expand, in Canada (maybe other commonwealth nations and other countries in general) ALL wildlife and natural resources whether on your land or not belongs to The Crown (the Government), as such removal or tampering of the wildlife without permission in the form of permission (hunting and fishing licenses for example) from The Crown is breaking the law as they are removing/stealing/tampering/damaging the Crowns property.

Odd little law based on this is your property may have a river cutting through it. You may legally own the land below the water (the river bed) but you CANNOT stop people from traveling "your" section of the river on a boat or other watercraft. The water itself falls under a similar cause like wildlife in our laws. Just as you need permission to mine gold/oil (or anything else) you found on your land, the minerals do not belong to you only the "land".

Dimitri

Crackshot

License or no, If my family need protein and we have no money to buy it, deer, elk, moose, what ever is dead. Laws and licensing matter not a wit to a man trying to feed his family.
However, I do not agree with killing any animal just for its head gear. Thats irresponcible and stupid.