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Glock Accidents
Discussions related to Guns and Firearms
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Vince
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 12:08 am    Post subject: Glock Accidents Reply with quote

A mate who is a Police Officer sent me this...a couple of good lessons here.

Don't know why everyone raves about the Glock, when they were 1st issued to Fed's in the mid-90's, "he" was meeting a buddy from DEA at a gin mill downtown. He came in, took off a heavy leather coat, threw it on the back of a bar stool & his Glock discharged.

Carried with no holster, in his coat pocket, a big ring of keys became lodged inside the trigger guard & when he threw the coat on the chair, the weight of the coat caused the keys to push the trigger. Nice big hole in the tile floor of Ranalli's on Dearborn.
Embarassed

Accidental Discharge - Holster FIRES Glock

For those of you who wear leather holsters, see below.

“What the hell was that?!?” she said. It took me a half a second to realize that my gun had just gone off…on my hip…in its holster. My wife and I had just finished breakfast at our favorite café and got into the car.

Me being the passenger, I rotated my torso to the left to fasten my seatbelt like I always do. When I straightened again, my Glock 19 discharged, blowing a 9mm hole through my pants, underwear, the leather seat and bottom of the car’s door frame.
wtf Confused Shocked

The bullet nicked my hip, but the wound is nothing a bandage couldn’t cover. So what went wrong? Guns never go “Bang” all by themselves.
After ensuring I wasn’t hemorrhaging profusely and didn’t have to make a dash for the hospital, I stayed seated in the car as my wife came around to my door and opened it. I undid my belt and slid the Galco JAK202 Slide Belt Holster, with the gun still in it, off my belt. Why it went off was immediately apparent.



The trusty, comfortable, leather holster I had been using for a year and two weeks had done what a baseball glove does after lots of use; It got soft. This particular holster carries the pistol outside the waistband, but inside the belt. The belt slides through slots in the outer side of the holster.
The problem stemmed from the leather on the inner side of the holster getting soft. A crease formed, which eventually was large enough to extend beyond the trigger. Manipulate the gun in just the wrong manner and this crease is no different than a finger on the trigger. Boom!



I can’t say I didn’t know the crease had been formed in the holster. I trained myself to be sure that when holstering, to make sure the gun was fully in the holster, with the trigger protected. On this day, did I forget to do that when I holstered up? Did the leather finally get so soft that a combination of body movements and interference by the cushy leather seat move the Glock enough to create a situation where the trigger was engaged by the holster?



I don’t think we’ll ever know for sure, but I’ll humbly admit to the former as the likely culprit. However, if it was the latter, then those of you who use this type of holster need to be aware of its limitations and the possibility of experiencing what I did.
It might have been a very different story had the incident happened while we were dining. That bullet ricocheting off the concrete floor could have done untold damage and just as easily killed somebody. Fortunately nobody got hurt and damage to the car was minimal. It will be an interesting conversation with the insurance company to see if they’ll cover the repairs.


Lessons Learned



Holstering your gun can be just as important as drawing it. Make sure you pay attention when doing so. If your leather is getting soft and worn, be sure that it won’t interfere with your trigger or just replace it.
The back of the slide and/or grip was being pushed downward into the leather holster…or the holster was being pushed upward with some force. My guess is the firearm was being pushed and the fold in the holster acted as a finger and depressed the Glock trigger safety.
This truly brings home the importance of taking care of your equipment and ensuring it’s in proper working order. Hopefully you can learn from my situation and prevent an accident like this from happening to you.


Cheers, Vince

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Gil Martin
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 1:55 am    Post subject: Re: Glock Accidents Reply with quote

I hate it when that happens. I have a large handgun collection and none of them are Glocks and never will be. The number of reported accidental discharges involving Glocks is staggering. My brother is a retired federal agent and has spoken of a number of accidental discharges where fellow agents used Glocks to put unintended holes in themselves or others. There are several videos where law enforcement types shoot themselves in front of crowds while talking about the safety of Glocks and their ability to handle them well. It is a personal decision. I believe Glocks should only be used by well-trained and experienced people. All the best...
Gil

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slimjim
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 5:07 am    Post subject: Re: Glock Accidents Reply with quote

I don't think this is unique to a Glock. Many pistols today are hammer-less with strickers. Any safety mechanizm can be bypassed by an interference or other human error. That's why I don't carry with one in the chamber (Condition 3). It wouldn't matter what pistol I had. I also don't like loading and unloading a firearm in my home. I have 4 Glocks and the only large caliber pistols I have. When I shoot at tactical matches, I draw with an empty chamber so that I practice like a carry. Other use this technique also.

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chambered221
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 5:24 am    Post subject: Re: Glock Accidents Reply with quote

Sorry Vince .........Ya can't blame the Glocks for those AD's !!!



Quote::
Carried with no holster, in his coat pocket, a big ring of keys became lodged inside the trigger guard

Quote::
I can’t say I didn’t know the crease had been formed in the holster. I trained myself to be sure that when holstering, to make sure the gun was fully in the holster, with the trigger protected. On this day, did I forget to do that when I holstered up?



Stupidity caused them !!!

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chambered221
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 5:35 am    Post subject: Re: Glock Accidents Reply with quote

slimjim wrote:
That's why I don't carry with one in the chamber (Condition 3).


Are there any academies or tactical shooting schools that teach/endorse that methodology ?

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Grumulkin
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 7:11 am    Post subject: Re: Glock Accidents Reply with quote

I wonder. Are there any other handguns out there that have accidentally discharged besides Glocks? Probably not.

Oh, by the way; I'm packing a Glock right now with one in the chamber.
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Dawgdad
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 10:47 am    Post subject: Re: Glock Accidents Reply with quote

We had one go off when a shooter was holstering it into a Serpa holster. Took a hunk out of his thigh. trigger cought on something other than his booger hook as RSO was right on him watching the stage of the match and swore as much under oath....

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DallanC
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 11:59 am    Post subject: Re: Glock Accidents Reply with quote

This post is one of the main reasons I went with a XD... it can't (shouldn't) fire unless both the grip and trigger safetys are depressed. I am careful when holstering so that the grip safety is never depressed. Generally I do not carry one in the chamber, but I treat the gun always as if it has.

Lots of people love the glocks, but I am not one of them (no offense to glock lovers out there Wink )


-DallanC
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slimjim
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 6:19 pm    Post subject: Re: Glock Accidents Reply with quote

chambered221 wrote:
Are there any academies or tactical shooting schools that teach/endorse that methodology ?

I originally read about this 10+ years ago and it was referred to as the Israeli Draw. It suited my needs. I didn't want to be loading and unloading a pistol in the house with my wife and kids around. They don't know when I carry so I didn't want the sound of a slide racking or an accidental discharge happening. I've seen others use this draw at tactical matches - obviously not be increase their chances at winning the match but to develop and instill the habit pattern.

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wiersy111
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2011 12:40 am    Post subject: Re: Glock Accidents Reply with quote

I have quietly watched and listened to the pro's and con's of the glock for years but have never found an argument that would sway me from the M1911. I am with chambered on this one the AD were caused by the owner. I prefer the the 1911 far above any other handgun, the 1911 is a little bulky but it has been tried and proven true for decades. The biggest pro for the glock i hear is they are reliable. Well I guess when the glock has a history of reliability as the M1911 I will consider purchasing one. But until the glock has been proven in as many conflicts as the M1911 I will not even consider it an equal competitor. I know there are a lot of guys and gals out there that will argue with me but the M1911's track record speaks for it's self...........argument over!!!!

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inthedark
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 12:56 am    Post subject: Re: Glock Accidents Reply with quote

chambered221 wrote:
slimjim wrote:
That's why I don't carry with one in the chamber (Condition 3).


Are there any academies or tactical shooting schools that teach/endorse that methodology ?

Not One!
The whole reason for carring a sidearm is to have a tool for immediate use to prevent "grievious bodily harm and or death"
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Vince
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 1:42 am    Post subject: Re: Glock Accidents Reply with quote

I am not sure about the Rules and Regulations of Police Departments in the US or Canada, but over here in Australia, you are allowed to carry only the issue sidearm, which in the majority of cases is a Glock of various models, depending on the State.

There is only one way to deal with the problem that this post highlights... training, training, training. This training must include the maintenance of ones accoutrements such as belt,HOLSTER, baton, handcuffs etc. When an item is showing signs of being unsafe, or failing through use, then it must be replaced. It is the responsibility of the individual to ensure this happens as a matter of urgency.

This is how it works in the Army over here and it is a good system that allows a soldier to keep his kit in good serviceable order and ready for use at all times. It is a simple "one for one" swap. A Police Officer is no different...he must keep his "tools of trade" functional and serviceable in order to be 100% capable of doing his job.

If the various Police Departments cannot afford to provide these items, and this would only apply to items such as belts, holsters and pouches, then the Officer himself should purchase the item. The Officer can then claim it on his tax as a necessary expenditure in the course of earning his taxable income.

Cheers, Vince

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Live simply. Love generously. Care deeply. Speak kindly. Leave the rest to God.

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Ominivision1
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 2:37 am    Post subject: Re: Glock Accidents Reply with quote

wiersy111 wrote:
But until the glock has been proven in as many conflicts as the M1911 I will not even consider it an equal competitor.

Cheers

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chambered221
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 6:29 am    Post subject: Re: Glock Accidents Reply with quote

Not that I would try dethroning the 1911........I do however believe the quality breed of plastic guns have proven themselves rather well !!!

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scrounge
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 10:36 am    Post subject: Re: Glock Accidents Reply with quote

Huh, I am just about to get my concealed permit and was considering a Glock. Sounds like a little more research would be a good idea. I like the 1911 better anyway.
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