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neck sizing
Discussion regarding the reloading of ammunition and tuning of loads for accuracy
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kentucky hareraiser
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 07, 2010 12:41 pm    Post subject: neck sizing Reply with quote

i now y'all have probably had this discussion at some point in time ,so this way i will again(hopefully) ge several opinions.. i jus got my dies in i ordered from midway(lee deluxe 3 die set) this way i get the shell holder too.. any way when i opened and looke i thought there was a mistake because ther was two brass resizers and the bullet seater. as i read into ihe insert more ,one was full lenth die andthe other was a neck resizer die. being confused,i just used the full lenth die like i do all the other cals i load. now to th question:: (#1)who all sizes just the neck ? what are the reasons ,the purpose and how does it help..(#2) who would rather use the full lenth die to resize the brass ,and also ,what are the rasons,the purposead how does this way help.. just curious,don't want to over work my brass if it's no needed... hope i'm not askin' to many questions to y'all.just like to get opinions of people who have experience at this Very Happy

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wncchester
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 07, 2010 4:48 pm    Post subject: Re: neck sizing Reply with quote

[quote= ...just like to get opinions of people who have experience at this :-D[/quote]

Neck sizing does little if anything for accuracy, it can help extend case life.

Your Lee collet neck sizer is the best available for factory chambers. Unlike any other, it requires no case lube. It has a moving part so it's not a simplistic "push the case in, pull thr case out" thing. It has a learning curve that can be greately shortened by following the directions.
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chambered221
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 07, 2010 5:19 pm    Post subject: Re: neck sizing Reply with quote

It boils down to consistency.........the more consistent the reloads the more consistent the groups !!! (hopefully)
Wilson neck dies take it one step further with their bushing dies that only size about half the neck.

The drawbacks;
Feeding from a magazine can be problematic.
Bolt can be hard to close.
Running the upper end of pressure may require FL sizing after 2 or 3 firings.

It use to be all benchrest shooters would neck size, now days they are having custom dies made for their specific chamber.
A lot of varmint hunters and casual paper punchers still use neck dies.
I plan to get one to work up a new load for my 221FB when the weather breaks.

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chambered221
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 07, 2010 5:34 pm    Post subject: Re: neck sizing Reply with quote

wncchester wrote:
Unlike any other, it requires no case lube. .

Not so !!! Neck Bushing dies can be had with carbide and titanium nitride !!!

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PaulS
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 07, 2010 11:21 pm    Post subject: Re: neck sizing Reply with quote

I use carbide neck sizing dies - no lube - at all (manufacturer's instructions).
I size just the upper 2/3 of the neck on my 3006 and all but the last part of the neck on my 358Win. I get better accuracy neck sizing (typically 1/2 MOA) with all my rifles. I have never crowded max loads and I have never had to full length size my cases since starting to neck size. I fire them once (new brass) after full length sizing and from then on I only neck size. I have some cases that have been fired more than 20 times with no problems chambering and case growth is minimal. (though I always run all the cases through the trimmer as part of my reloading regimen)
The unsized portion of the neck helps to keep the bullet centered and the unsized case fits the chamber with little clearance. If the case gets tighter in the chamber I figure it has too much pressure because the case is supposed to expand under pressure and then spring back a bit to release the case from the wall of the chamber. If the brass does not spring back then it means the chamber has expanded with the case to a point beyond the elasticity of the brass - a definite "OVER-PRESSURE" condition. I have experienced this "OVER-PRESSURE" condition with some guns well under the listed maximum load. I just figure in this particular gun that load is an over-pressure load and cut it back.
OK, I AM a conservative loader. I look for the most accurate load that demonstrates no signs of excess pressure (by my definition) and is consistent under a wide range of conditions over a long period of time. My brass lasts a very long time and it keeps my guns and me happy and safe.

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kentucky hareraiser
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 1:47 pm    Post subject: Re: neck sizing Reply with quote

sound like a winner,,i'll slow down on shooting the 20 rounds i've shot once and reloaded until the weather warms a tad,since my reloading shack is away from the house.don't like runnin' out just to do a few shells ya know..did get good accuracy with the FL sized brass though..if neck sizing is better for accuracy,,thay will be great..thank's all

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chambered221
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 3:51 pm    Post subject: Re: neck sizing Reply with quote

Paul, You might be a conservative re-loader but IMO your approach is the best way to go about neck sizing.

It is because of your past postings on the subject that I've decided to re-try the neck sizing thing !!!

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wncchester
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 22, 2010 9:19 am    Post subject: Re: neck sizing Reply with quote

"Unlike any other, it requires no case lube. .

Not so !!! Neck Bushing dies can be had with carbide and titanium nitride !!!"

Correct, my bad. I was thinking only of conventional (non-bushing) neck dies.
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Dawgdad
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 22, 2010 9:42 am    Post subject: Re: neck sizing Reply with quote

One Caveat - neck sizing is not advised for semi autos. Bolt guns or single shots that remain closed for the entire firing sequence yes, you can get some improved precision by neck sizing, Do it on a Semiauto and you are asking for failure to feed.

( this is due to bolt disengaging and extraction occuring while the case is still under pressure - brass flows down full length of case not just forward to fill headspace.)

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slimjim
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 22, 2010 11:13 am    Post subject: Re: neck sizing Reply with quote

I just neck size for all my bolt guns. As PaulS stated, I have had my .308 cases stretch and become hard to close the bolt because I was running near maximum load. It was also Federal Brass which doesn't have that good of a reputation for longevity.
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RePete
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 25, 2010 9:45 am    Post subject: Re: neck sizing Reply with quote

Dawgdad wrote:
One Caveat - neck sizing is not advised for semi autos. Bolt guns or single shots that remain closed for the entire firing sequence yes, you can get some improved precision by neck sizing, Do it on a Semiauto and you are asking for failure to feed.

( this is due to bolt disengaging and extraction occuring while the case is still under pressure - brass flows down full length of case not just forward to fill headspace.)

Been there done that. Embarassed

Over the years I full length sized and then I started to have a few rounds not wanting to chamber properly, so now I small base size for my semi's and bolts with no apparent effect on accuracy.

The only bolt gun I haven't SB sized for is my .338LM, because I haven't found any plus I haven't looked too hard either.

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slimjim
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:23 am    Post subject: Re: neck sizing Reply with quote

PaulS wrote:
I size just the upper 2/3 of the neck on my 3006 and all but the last part of the neck on my 358Win.

PaulS, is there a special technique to only partially sizing the neck or do you just leave extra space for the neck-sizing button to get pushed up into its cavity. I'm going to start partial neck sizing and would appreciate any tips.

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MacD
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:39 am    Post subject: Re: neck sizing Reply with quote

Darn Slim, you ask some really good ones. Will be interested in the answer.

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PaulS
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 10:54 pm    Post subject: Re: neck sizing Reply with quote

I use carbide neck sizing dies. There is no "button and I just adjust the die in the press until it sizes just what I need.
I think you could do the same with almost any die other than a collet style sizing die - even then ... maybe.
With cartridges that have a lot of taper you can use the standard full length die because unless you have a big chamber you won't start resizing the body of the case until the neck is more than half way sized.

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slimjim
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2012 2:18 pm    Post subject: Re: neck sizing Reply with quote

So you don't have S-Type Dies ... hmmm. I have some experimenting to do.

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