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Over All Case Length
Discussion regarding the reloading of ammunition and tuning of loads for accuracy
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Alan300RUM
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2007 10:03 pm    Post subject: Over All Case Length Reply with quote

I was wondering if any of you have run into this problem.

After going throught the process of using an OAL Gage to find the correct depth to seat my bullet, it turns out that they are to long to fit down into the magazine. I don't see any way to modify the mag. box because it fits up into the bottom of the action.

This on a Remington LSS 300 RUM (The same one that I'm struggleing with in my other post). I've only done this with one bullet, and I'm about to try a different bullet, so maybe I'll have better results with it.

Thanks,

Alan
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GUTS
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2007 10:55 pm    Post subject: Re: Over All Case Length Reply with quote

Some rifles have a longer freebore or throat, making it impossible to use the magazine with loads seated just off the lands. The way around this is to chamber the rounds one at a time without the mag. Sometimes, especially with semi-auto rifles this is the case.
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Pumpkinslinger
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 2:17 am    Post subject: Re: Over All Case Length Reply with quote

I have the same problem with at least one rifle, a Ruger 77/.22 Hornet. Some bullets simply are too long to ever work right in this rifle. However, with some tinkering, it still shot groups just under an inch with bullets seated short enough to feed through the magazine. The way I figure it, if the rounds won't feed right they have limited use.

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chambered221
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 6:54 am    Post subject: Re: Over All Case Length Reply with quote

Evryone wants to seat their bullets as close to the rifling as possible. The reality is in most cases it can't be done if you want the ammo to feed from the magizine box.

When I'm trying new loads or get a new gun, the length of the box is taken into acount right from the get go.

Don't worry about it !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Alot of guns shoot good with the ogive of the bullet set off the lands .020-.040. I've got two guns right now that shoot their best this way. And I know there are others on this site that will tell you the same.
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K.W.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 12:08 pm    Post subject: Re: Over All Case Length Reply with quote

With high powered calipers like Wheaterby magnums "they" think that bullet must to bee far enough from riflings. I don´t like "them". So I use rebarreled and tight chambered guns. I have T/C Contender and BRNO-110 also one shot break open .22 Hornets. When bulletts are in the riflings, they are very accurate.
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shrpshtrjoe
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 2:57 pm    Post subject: Re: Over All Case Length Reply with quote

The guy's pretty much covered it in most cases ya can't unless ya feed them like a single shot.
Joe

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steve4102
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 23, 2007 6:55 am    Post subject: Re: Over All Case Length Reply with quote

chambered221 wrote:
Evryone wants to seat their bullets as close to the rifling as possible. The reality is in most cases it can't be done if you want the ammo to feed from the magizine box.

When I'm trying new loads or get a new gun, the length of the box is taken into acount right from the get go.

Don't worry about it !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Alot of guns shoot good with the ogive of the bullet set off the lands .020-.040. I've got two guns right now that shoot their best this way. And I know there are others on this site that will tell you the same.

+1
Barnes did a test awhile back on seating depth, accuracy and pressure. Their results showed more than one OAL sweet spot. One quite long and another quite short. If I can find it I will post it here.
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Pumpkinslinger
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 23, 2007 8:22 pm    Post subject: Re: Over All Case Length Reply with quote

I think the key here is to have the bullet leave the muzzle at the peak or the trough of the barrel vibration. Those are the points where the barrel is moving the least. That can be adjusted some by changing the seating depth. The BOSS system accomplishes the same thing by tuning the barrel vibration to the load. Without the BOSS you try to tune the load to the barrel vibration. Anybody know of ways to figure the barrel vibration frequency? That would give you a wave length that could help figure out how much to change the seating depth.

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GroovyJack
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2007 4:26 pm    Post subject: Re: Over All Case Length Reply with quote

Sorry I dont buy into the boss crap , I understand the harmonics and all , but jus another gimmick ..

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Morax
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2007 4:58 pm    Post subject: Re: Over All Case Length Reply with quote

GroovyJack wrote:
Sorry I dont buy into the boss crap , I understand the harmonics and all , but jus another gimmick ..

i thought the same way for a long time, seen the results first hand with a buddies 6mm, the harmonics and accual movement of the barrel really change a lot!
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GroovyJack
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2007 5:08 pm    Post subject: Re: Over All Case Length Reply with quote

My question wud be this , what was/is a quantifiable gain in accuracy or velocity ??

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steve4102
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 25, 2007 3:36 pm    Post subject: Re: Over All Case Length Reply with quote

GroovyJack wrote:
Sorry I dont buy into the boss crap , I understand the harmonics and all , but jus another gimmick ..

Are you a sceptic of the "barrel Tuners' via first hand experience or is this just your opinion?
I have a BOSS equipped Browning BAR that shoots amazingly well for an auto-loader. It takes some range time to find that "sweet Spot", but it works and it work very well.
There are a lot of shooters out there praising the effects of the "Barrel Tuner". From Benchrest shooters to hunters alike the barrel tuner is the Real Deal.
Here is some food for thought.
www.ozfclass.com/artic...05_03.html

benchrest.com/forums/s...p?p=186636

www.benchrestspecialti...tuners.htm

www.zediker.com/books/...nical.html

www.6mmbr.com/gunweek050.html
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GroovyJack
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 25, 2007 4:11 pm    Post subject: Re: Over All Case Length Reply with quote

I havent read yur links , but I will after I post this ..

No first hand experience , only the stuff I have read touting it's benefits ..
When I read that it gives you 50-75 fps more velocity , my reply is , I have seen that much variation in factory loaded ammo over a chrony ..
When someone writes that groups are tightened up by a quarter or half inch , my reply is that I and others as well can do that on a good range day ..
I'm not saying it doesnt werk , I am only saying that what I have read hasnt convinced me of any great benefit in a hunting rifle ..
We are all different , my hunting stays in side 200 yards , my smallest rifle is a 458 Lott that shoots a 1.5" five shot group at one hundred all day long , as long as I do my part ..
I am no longer interested in extreme range shooting , doesnt interest me very much anymore ..
My hunting is close range in the woods down here , Alaska , and Africa ..
I am not interested in if you can shoot the eyeball off a gnat at 300 yards , I am interested in how you will handle a wounded and mad cape buffalo at six feet and closing ..
I have no doubts , that it may werk , I spent my career in Naval Gunnery , and am open to anything ..
Perhaps my opinion is based on the fact that it really would not benefit me personally ..

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Deleted_User_2665
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2007 5:42 pm    Post subject: Re: Over All Case Length Reply with quote

Seat for function and fit.....

R&D with OCW and forget junk like the BOSS..................
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hunterjoe21
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Location: North Central Montana

PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2007 6:21 pm    Post subject: Re: Over All Case Length Reply with quote

wildswalker wrote:
Seat for function and fit.....

R&D with OCW and forget junk like the BOSS..................

Heya Wildswalker

Aint seen many opinions from you lately.......

Hunting seasons here are winding down(we have a 4 day ML season left, it starts 1/2 hour before sunup tomorrow), then it's back to load work for the .22-250. Gonna scrap what I have so far and start over using OCW methods. Seems like I should get there a LOT quicker that way............


Just wanted to say thanks for tippin' me off to it.........

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