HuntingNut
HuntingNut
   Login or Register
HomeCommunity ForumsPhoto AlbumsRegister
     
 

User Info

Welcome Anonymous


Membership:
Latest: IPutMoInYoA
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 13131

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 327
BOT: 1
Total: 328
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Your Account
02: Photo Albums
03: Home
04: Home
05: Home
06: Forums
07: Forums
08: Forums
09: Forums
10: Home
11: Your Account
12: Your Account
13: Forums
14: Your Account
15: Forums
16: Forums
17: Forums
18: Forums
19: Home
20: Forums
21: Forums
22: Forums
23: Forums
24: Forums
25: Forums
26: Forums
27: Forums
28: Your Account
29: Home
30: Your Account
31: Home
32: Forums
33: Forums
34: Forums
35: Your Account
36: Forums
37: Your Account
38: Home
39: Forums
40: Forums
41: Forums
42: Home
43: Your Account
44: Forums
45: Forums
46: Home
47: Forums
48: Forums
49: Forums
50: Your Account
51: Home
52: Forums
53: Forums
54: Forums
55: Forums
56: Home
57: Forums
58: Forums
59: Forums
60: Home
61: Forums
62: Forums
63: Home
64: Forums
65: Forums
66: Forums
67: Forums
68: Forums
69: Forums
70: Forums
71: Your Account
72: Forums
73: Forums
74: Forums
75: Forums
76: Forums
77: Your Account
78: Forums
79: Forums
80: Your Account
81: Forums
82: Forums
83: Your Account
84: Forums
85: Forums
86: Forums
87: Articles: Submit New
88: Forums
89: Photo Albums
90: Your Account
91: Home
92: Forums
93: Forums
94: Your Account
95: Forums
96: Home
97: Forums
98: Forums
99: Forums
100: Your Account
101: Your Account
102: Home
103: Forums
104: Home
105: Your Account
106: Forums
107: Your Account
108: Forums
109: Forums
110: Forums
111: Forums
112: Forums
113: Forums
114: Forums
115: Forums
116: Your Account
117: Your Account
118: Forums
119: Home
120: Your Account
121: Home
122: Forums
123: Forums
124: Your Account
125: Forums
126: Forums
127: Forums
128: Your Account
129: Forums
130: Forums
131: Forums
132: Forums
133: Forums
134: Forums
135: Forums
136: Forums
137: Forums
138: Home
139: Your Account
140: Your Account
141: Home
142: Your Account
143: Forums
144: Forums
145: Your Account
146: Forums
147: Forums
148: Forums
149: Forums
150: Forums
151: Forums
152: Forums
153: Your Account
154: Forums
155: Your Account
156: Forums
157: Home
158: Forums
159: Photo Albums
160: Forums
161: Your Account
162: Forums
163: Your Account
164: Your Account
165: Your Account
166: Home
167: Forums
168: Your Account
169: Forums
170: Forums
171: Home
172: Forums
173: Your Account
174: Your Account
175: Forums
176: Forums
177: Forums
178: Your Account
179: Forums
180: Forums
181: Home
182: Forums
183: Your Account
184: Forums
185: Home
186: Forums
187: Home
188: Forums
189: Forums
190: Forums
191: Forums
192: Your Account
193: Your Account
194: Home
195: Forums
196: Forums
197: Your Account
198: Forums
199: Forums
200: Your Account
201: Forums
202: Your Account
203: Forums
204: Photo Albums
205: Forums
206: Forums
207: Forums
208: Forums
209: Forums
210: Forums
211: Home
212: Forums
213: Forums
214: Forums
215: Your Account
216: Forums
217: Forums
218: Forums
219: Forums
220: Forums
221: Forums
222: Your Account
223: Forums
224: Your Account
225: Forums
226: Forums
227: Photo Albums
228: Forums
229: Forums
230: Forums
231: Forums
232: Your Account
233: Forums
234: Forums
235: Your Account
236: Home
237: Forums
238: Forums
239: Forums
240: Forums
241: Your Account
242: Forums
243: Forums
244: Forums
245: Forums
246: Forums
247: Your Account
248: Your Account
249: Your Account
250: Home
251: Home
252: Home
253: Forums
254: Your Account
255: Forums
256: Forums
257: Forums
258: Forums
259: Forums
260: Your Account
261: Home
262: Forums
263: Your Account
264: Forums
265: Home
266: Forums
267: Your Account
268: Home
269: Forums
270: Your Account
271: Your Account
272: Forums
273: Forums
274: Your Account
275: Home
276: Your Account
277: Forums
278: Forums
279: Your Account
280: Home
281: Forums
282: Forums
283: Forums
284: Forums
285: Forums
286: Forums
287: Forums
288: Your Account
289: Photo Albums
290: Your Account
291: Forums
292: Forums
293: Forums
294: Your Account
295: Forums
296: Forums
297: Forums
298: News
299: Your Account
300: Forums
301: Home
302: Forums
303: Your Account
304: Home
305: Forums
306: Forums
307: Forums
308: Your Account
309: Your Account
310: Home
311: Forums
312: Photo Albums
313: Forums
314: Forums
315: Your Account
316: Your Account
317: Your Account
318: Home
319: Forums
320: Forums
321: Forums
322: Your Account
323: Your Account
324: Home
325: Your Account
326: Your Account
327: Your Account
  BOT:
01: Home

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
 

Coppermine Stats
Photo Albums
 Albums: 308
 Pictures: 2452
  · Views: 824588
  · Votes: 1316
  · Comments: 86
 

  The Great .308 versus .30-06 Debate

ShootingThe Great .308 versus .30-06 Debate
A chat room discussion got me looking hard at the “.308 Winchester vs. .30-06 Springfield” debate. My contention was that there was no significant difference between the ballistics of the two in hunting situations, or for that matter in any other situation. So let’s examine the ballistics of both cartridges and compare.
First we’ll take a quick look at the history of both cartridges. The .30-06 Springfield started life as a US military cartridge in 1906. It was derived from the “.30 Model 1903” cartridge that was designed to replace the .30-40 Krag. The ’03 cartridge used the same 220 grain round nosed bullet as the .30-40. The ’06 is essentially the same case as the ’03 with a 150 grain spitzer bullet at 2800 ft/sec. The .30-06 was the primary cartridge for the US military until it was “replaced” by the .308 Winchester/7.62x51mm NATO in 1954. The .308’s original load was a 149 grain spitzer at 2800 ft/sec. Both cartridges have certainly been very successful in military, match and hunting use! (Reference “Handloading” by William C. Davis, Jr.)

To quote the Speer #13 manual, “In the hunting field, ballistic differences between the 308 and the 30-06 are negligible.” The .308 was designed to duplicate the .30-06 for military use, but in a half inch shorter package. Both guns use the same 0.308” bullets. These bullets range from 100 grains to 250 grains in various styles. I figured that the .30-06 would have an advantage as the bullets get over 180 grains because its case was originally designed for the heavier bullets.
The most common hunting bullet weights for these cartridges are the 150, 165 and 180 grain. I realize that there are tons of loads for each cartridge but you’ve gotta start somewhere. I looked in the Speer #13 manual and compared their loads for both cartridges. I figure this is a pretty good comparison as loads for both cartridges were fired in the same type rifle, a Remington 700 with a 22” barrel. In each case I took the bullet with the highest ballistic coefficient and the highest velocity listed.

Here is a chart of the muzzle velocities for each bullet for both cartridges, the difference between them (.30-06 minus .308) and the percentage of that difference:
Bullet weight .308 .30-06 Difference %
150 2919 2847 -72 ft/sec -2.5
165 2812 2803 -9 ft/sec -0.3
180 2623 2756 133 ft/sec 4.8

From the chart we can see that the average difference in velocities for the three bullets is 17 ft/sec, or 0.6%, in favor of the .30-06. Now don’t forget that these are average velocities. In a string of shots a cartridge/gun’s velocity can easily have a standard deviation of 1% or more. In other words the normal variations in loads result in a built-in error that pretty much means we can’t count on such a small difference to be meaningful.

So, what does all this mean downrange? We’ll zero both guns at 200 yards and compare the bullet energy there. Let’s also take a look at what the bullets will be doing at 400 yards, which is a heck of a long shot for hunting. I used the “PointBlank” ballistics program to make the comparisons.

With the 150 grain bullet the .308 has 2093 foot-pounds of energy at 200 yards while the .30-06 has 1985 foot-pounds. Out at 400 yards the .308 will have dropped 20.9 inches, and still has 1512 foot-pounds. The .30-06 will have dropped 22.13 inches and maintains 1428 foot-pounds. The .308 shows 5.9% more energy at 400 yards.

Then with the 165 grain bullet 200 yards the .308 shows 2202 foot-pounds versus 2187 foot-pounds for the .30-06. At 400 yards the .308 drops 21.90 inches and has 1645 foot-pounds. The .30-06 drops 22.06 inches with 1633 foot-pounds left. At 400 yards the .308 has a tiny 0.7% energy advantage.

Finally we take the 180 grain bullet, which should give the biggest advantage to the .30-06. At the 200 yard mark the .308 will have an energy of 2143 foot-pounds and the .30-06 will have 2379 foot-pounds. The .30-06 has about 11% more energy. When we get out to 400 yards the .308 will be 24.64 inches low and still have 1647 foot-pounds while the .30-06 will be 22.10 inches low and still carry 1840 foot-pounds. That means that at 400 yards the .30-06 has an 11.7% advantage in energy.

Now I’m sure that folks will look up their favorite of these two and “prove” that it is better in some manual or another. I looked in some other manuals too and found varying velocities. One thing I noticed in one manual was that, with 250 grain bullets (yes, that is two hundred and fifty grains), there was only 100 feet per sec difference in the velocities of the two cartridges. That particular manual doesn’t give any barrel lengths though.

Just for giggles I also looked at the .270 Winchester and .280 Remington loads in the same Speer manual. With a 22” barrel and a 150 grain bullet at 2907 feet per second the .270 has 2170 foot-pounds at 200 yards and 1648 foot-pounds at 400 yards, while dropping 19.98 inches. The .280, with a 24” barrel and a 145 grain bullet at 2975 feet per second, shows 2209 foot-pounds at 200 yards and 1689 foot-pounds at 400 yards, while dropping 18.83”. So, both of these cartridges “beat” the .30 caliber rounds in energy and trajectory.

When it’s all said and done does either the .308 or the .30-06 really have any ballistic advantage over the other? I’ll concede that an 11% difference in energy with the 180 grain bullet is an advantage but I wonder if a deer on the receiving end tell the difference between 1647 and 1840 foot-pounds of energy? Considering the overall differences and performance of both cartridges I’ll stick to my assertion that there is no SIGNIFICANT ballistic advantage with either cartridge. Now just pick which ever you like and enjoy shooting it!

Posted by Pumpkinslinger on Tuesday, October 16, 2007 (18:29:48) (37436 reads) [ Administration ]
Related Links
 More about Shooting

Most read story about Shooting:
BUILDING THE SWEDISH MAUSER SPORTER
 

Article Rating
Average Score: 4.63
Votes: 46


Please take a second and vote for this article:

Excellent
Very Good
Good
Regular
Bad

 

 

Valid CSS! Valid HTML 4.01!
Click to check if this page is realy HTML 4.01 compliant for speed :)

All logos and trademarks in this site are property of HuntingNut.com.
The comments are property of their posters, all the rest © 2011 by HuntingNut.com
Interactive software released under GNU GPL, Code Credits, Privacy Policy

.: Upgraded to DragonFly 9.2 by *Dizfunkshunal* :.