View previous topic :: View next topic |
Author |
Message |
tbox61 Member
Joined: Aug 31, 2005 Posts: 76 Location: Great Bend, KS
|
Posted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 8:01 am Post subject: Neck sizing question |
|
Morning everyone!
Well, I've been gone for awhile, but am back!
I just started neck sizing with a Lee Collett die for my .22 Hornet, and will start on my .223 after I get through the brass I full-length sized.
Since I have been FLR for the last 20 or so years, and just started Neck Sizing, I am going to ask a dumb question.
Do you treat the Neck Sized cases the same way as you do a Full-Length Resized ones as far as case trimming? My Hornet cases were all under the Max OAL, so I did not worry about it, but want to know for the future.
Once again, I'm glad to be back! This forum is the most friendly, laid back, bunch I have ever been around!
Make it a great day!
Tim
_________________ There are 2 theories to arguing with a woman...neither works.
Will Rogers |
|
Back to top |
|
|
guncollector Member
Joined: Apr 25, 2006 Posts: 68 Location: Houston, Texas
|
Posted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 8:44 am Post subject: Re: Neck sizing question |
|
The short answer is yes although neck sized cases will not grow in length as much as full length resized cases.
You mention a 223 - if you are reloading for a semiauto like an AR15, you really should always full length resize to insure ejection. If it is for a bolt gun, neck sizing is fine.
_________________ If the Government doesn't trust us with our guns, why should we trust them with theirs? |
|
Back to top |
|
|
tbox61 Member
Joined: Aug 31, 2005 Posts: 76 Location: Great Bend, KS
|
Posted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 10:40 am Post subject: Re: Neck sizing question |
|
Guncollector:
Thanks for your response--kinda thought I should!
How many times do you neck size before doing a full-length resize? When it starts chambering hard?
Most of my shooting is under actual hunting conditions, mostly coyote calling. I want my rifles to be as accurate as possible, but don't want to lose a coyote or bobcat due to my own ammunition not chambering properly!
Tim
_________________ There are 2 theories to arguing with a woman...neither works.
Will Rogers |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Blaine Member
Joined: Feb 24, 2005 Posts: 260 Location: Maine
|
Posted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 5:16 pm Post subject: Re: Neck sizing question |
|
As far as when to FLR, You have answered your own question. When they get hard to chamber, it's time to think about it. It will vary by gun and how "hot" the load is as to how many times. I have a 308 Stevens that I have neck sized the cases for as many as 5 times before needing to FLR. The load I shoot in it is very light, though. There is still some metal flow to the neck, so I make sure I trim the necks each time I shoot a batch. I like to have all my cases exactly the same, so I trim even though I may only take .001-.002" off some of them. I try to find the shortest cases and trim to that.
Blaine
_________________ Shoot straight and above all shoot SMART....and remember God is still in control !!!! |
|
Back to top |
|
|
guncollector Member
Joined: Apr 25, 2006 Posts: 68 Location: Houston, Texas
|
Posted: Thu Jul 13, 2006 9:27 am Post subject: Re: Neck sizing question |
|
I do it the same way as Blaine. It might be a small waste of time to trim the overall length every resizing but it might just also be the little bit of accuracy you need on a long shot.
On a 270Win, I get at least 10 neck sizings out of a case before I need to FLR. On some magnum cartridges maybe only 3.
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
calsibley Super Member
Joined: Jan 28, 2005 Posts: 317
|
Posted: Mon Aug 21, 2006 6:49 pm Post subject: Re: Neck sizing question |
|
I have some cases I've neck sized dozens of times without needing to full length size. I only size down the first third of the neck though. The only problem you might have is if the case shoulders get blown out which will happen occasionally the neck dies will not bump them back like a full length sizer. Best wishes.
Cal - Montreal
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
PaulS Super Member
Joined: Feb 18, 2006 Posts: 4330 Location: South-Eastern Washington - the State
|
Posted: Mon Aug 21, 2006 11:45 pm Post subject: Re: Neck sizing question |
|
I have cases that I have loaded more times than most will load a case without ever full length sizing. I size as much of the neck that I have to to hold the bullet - it varys from caliber to caliber and depends a lot on the bullet weight but I never touch the shoulder junction. I can do this because I load mid range loads for accuracy over velocity every time. My 30-'06 load is a 165 grain BTSP at 2675 fps from a 24 inch barrel. I load these by neck sizing, depriming, run it through the trimmer (a useless exercise), clean, prime, charge and sink a bullet on top. I have omitted some lubing, cleaning steps but that is all I need to do after the cases are prepared and fired the first time. If you don't over work the brass, with your loads or sizing, the brass pretty much stays the same size and doesn't grow. If I load hot I can immediately see the difference as the cases need trimming and begin to show the signs of stretching in length. I just don't need that extra 100 fps to kill the game I am aiming at. What I do demand is sub MOA accuracy. If a rifle won't shoot sub MOA I don't keep it long enough to call it mine. Surprisingly enough I have only had two guns that I could not get to shoot in that category. One was an SKS - I severly modified that one and the other was a 30-30 Marlin with microgroove barrel that was so shot out you could push a 308 diameter bullet from chamber to muzzle with a wood dowel. It has gone to the place that shot out rifles go - I just hope the one who bought it put a barrel on it. I am not a big fan of lightweight 30-30's with hard butt plates. I swear it kicked worse than my 30-'06!
_________________ Paul
__________________
Speer, Lyman, Hodgdon, Sierra, and Hornady = reliable loading data
So and So's pages on the internet = NOT reliable loading data
Always check data against manuals
NEVER exceed maximum listed loads |
|
Back to top |
|
|
yottee Rookie Member
Joined: Jan 11, 2006 Posts: 4
|
Posted: Tue Aug 22, 2006 12:28 am Post subject: Re: Neck sizing question |
|
except for my ar all i do is neck size. i use the lee collett in 223 and 22-250 one thing that i have found,i hit low about 2 inches after i full lengh size, once the cases are fire formed again, impact goes back to where i originaly had it.i dont know if this has happend with other loaders or not,but good to know before taking a 300yd shot at a coyote
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
tbox61 Member
Joined: Aug 31, 2005 Posts: 76 Location: Great Bend, KS
|
Posted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 11:23 am Post subject: Re: Neck sizing question |
|
Thanks for all of the help! I should be getting my Lee Collet die from Midway today.
Do any of you notice a different POI from full-length sized to neck sized in the same gun? I obviously will shoot to see where I am hitting after I reload the neck sized rounds, but just wanted some more input before I go out and start re-zeoring.
Tim
_________________ There are 2 theories to arguing with a woman...neither works.
Will Rogers |
|
Back to top |
|
|
squirrelbait Member
Joined: Sep 23, 2005 Posts: 220 Location: Nottingham, NH
|
Posted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 11:55 am Post subject: Re: Neck sizing question |
|
Yottee, I get the same thing with new brass before I "fireform" them to my chamber. Must be internal volumn etc...? Just did a small bunch of 243s that were all low and not grouping very well.
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
isd68 Rookie Member
Joined: Mar 18, 2006 Posts: 2 Location: Alberta, Canada
|
Posted: Mon Aug 28, 2006 8:29 pm Post subject: Re: Neck sizing question |
|
Just bought a set of Redding dies for my .220 Swift and it is the deluxe set with a neck sizing die. Do I need to lube the cases when using neck sizer?
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
popgun Member
Joined: Jan 26, 2005 Posts: 735 Location: Mitchell, GA, U.S.A. (2007 pop. 191)
|
Posted: Mon Aug 28, 2006 10:12 pm Post subject: Re: Neck sizing question |
|
You could probably get by without any lubrication but I would suggest a dry lube like Mica. MidwayUSA and others have kits to lubricate the inside and outside of the neck for neck sizing.
_________________ Safe shooting,
Chris Young, aka: popgun, Moderator
I don't know everything but I have made most of the mistakes already and lived through many of them. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
isd68 Rookie Member
Joined: Mar 18, 2006 Posts: 2 Location: Alberta, Canada
|
Posted: Mon Aug 28, 2006 10:17 pm Post subject: Re: Neck sizing question |
|
So I am assuming that the actual case does not need to be lubed, only the neck area? Wasn't sure if the case wall touched the die or not.
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
Vince Site Admin
Joined: May 25, 2005 Posts: 15704 Location: Brisbane AUSTRALIA
|
Posted: Tue Aug 29, 2006 5:46 am Post subject: Re: Neck sizing question |
|
yottee wrote: |
except for my ar all i do is neck size. i use the lee collett in 223 and 22-250 one thing that i have found,i hit low about 2 inches after i full lengh size, once the cases are fire formed again, impact goes back to where i originaly had it.i dont know if this has happend with other loaders or not,but good to know before taking a 300yd shot at a coyote |
squirrelbait wrote: |
Yottee, I get the same thing with new brass before I "fireform" them to my chamber. Must be internal volumn etc...? Just did a small bunch of 243s that were all low and not grouping very well. |
Hm, this is an interesting thought. It might just account for some erratic groups.......I know I can't be to blame .
Seriously though, it is something that I will now take into account when doing load development/testing.
Thanks for the info guys.
Cheers, Vince
_________________ Cheers, Vince
Illegitimi non carborundum
(Never let the bastards grind you down)
Live simply. Love generously. Care deeply. Speak kindly. Leave the rest to God.
"Nulla Si Fa Senza Volonta."
(Without Commitment, Nothing Gets Done) |
|
Back to top |
|
|
squirrelbait Member
Joined: Sep 23, 2005 Posts: 220 Location: Nottingham, NH
|
Posted: Tue Aug 29, 2006 5:47 am Post subject: Re: Neck sizing question |
|
isd68, actually that is a good point. I don't have neck size only die. I just set my fl resizing die to get the top .25 inches of the case without hitting the shoulder. The die actually does "squeeze" the case down just above the webbing. If I didn't use lube it would be bad news........a lot of stuck cases. I assume if I had the neck size only this would not be an issue??
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
|