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New Varmint Gun
By Popular Demand: Discussions related to Varmint Hunting
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Crackshot
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2008 11:51 am    Post subject: Re: New Varmint Gun Reply with quote

Its heavy. The barrel alone weights in at almost 4.5 lbs, The free float tube is another 1.5 lbs probably.
My kids have been shooting aince they could hold a rifle up on their own.

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SingleShotLover
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 5:58 am    Post subject: Re: New Varmint Gun Reply with quote

Handloader wrote:
tech spec man

One of the oft repeated myths about ballistics is that heavier bullets will actually shoot with less drop than lighter bullets in the same caliber, presuming the shape of the bullet is identical. No so. The lighter bullet at the higher velocity will typically continue to have less drop. This is due to time of flight and the initial velocity of the lighter bullet.

Handloader,

Reading back on this thread I ran into the above and admit that I'm a little confused. When similar construction and shape is considered, bullets that are heavy for their diameter can retain velocity better than lighter ones of the same diameter and that translates to less bullet drop at extended ranges past their “zero” point. Granted that many times this only begins to manifest itself at ranges that don’t really matter to most shooters, this does exist. The heavier bullet creates an inertia effect that resists slowing better than bullets with less mass. We all know that bullets with higher Ballistic Coefficients as a general rule hold their downrange trajectories better. BC will always favor longer bullets over shorter ones…assuming equal diameter and configuration. Heavier bullets will exhibit higher mid-range trajectories than lighter ones when zeroed to the same point of impact. Maybe that is what you meant?

As a quick example, if we run the numbers through PointBlank we see that once we reach the 550-yard mark a .224" 55-grain Hornady VMax bullet (BC .252) fired at 3,700 fps and sighted for a 250 yard zero begins losing ground to a .224" 75-grain AMax (BC .435) that starts with at a muzzle velocity of 3,200 fps.

An even larger gap is apparent when the 36-grain Varmint Grenade is fired at 4,200 fps and compared against the above 75-grain load. They are dead-even at the 300-yard mark where velocity has dropped to 2,200 fps for the VG while the 75-grain bullet is still traveling nearly 2,600 fps and the energy figures aren’t even in the same ballpark. At 500 yards the trajectory difference is nearly 10 inches in favor of the 75-grain. That short, light Varmint Grenade, while deadly within its intended range, sheds velocity far to quickly for extended-range shooting when compared against heavier bullets of the same caliber.

Am I missing something here? Confused

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foreign
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PostPosted: Sat May 03, 2008 1:08 am    Post subject: Re: New Varmint Gun Reply with quote

sounds rite to me. thats y im chooseing to shoot 65gr as aposed to 55gr in the .234. but then again i want a flat shooting round for bunnies to 400m
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Pumpkinslinger
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PostPosted: Sat May 03, 2008 10:02 am    Post subject: Re: New Varmint Gun Reply with quote

Ballistic coefficient. Depending on the shape the heavier bullet will move through the air better, losing less velocity.

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Grumulkin
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PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2008 7:31 pm    Post subject: Re: New Varmint Gun Reply with quote

My varmint gun. A 375 H&H Magnum shooting Hornady 300 gr. RN FMJ bullets will kill a Jackal.
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Handloader
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PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2008 9:51 pm    Post subject: Re: New Varmint Gun Reply with quote

Howdy SingleShotLover

If you can access to a Barnes #3 manual you will find a bullet drop chart for most popular cartridges and one pattern or consistency is noted. The faster bullet will drop less at any given distance. Lighter bullets are faster.
Heavier bullets are less affected by crosswind. They retain more energy and because of SD, penetrate better. They are rarely flatter shooting. BUT, Barnes only lists to 400yds.

By example, my 220 Swift will launch 35gr Bergers at 4,612 fps and 55gr Nosler BTs at 3,835. At 600 yards, the Noslers strike ten inches lower than the Bergers when both are sighted in at 200yds, however, the wind drift on the Nosler is half as much. This is the result of actual testing.

I have a 308 HB which when sighted in at 200yds will be 7" low at 300 and about 20" low at 400 with 110gr SP. The 165gr HPBT records 9" and 25" respectively.

Perhaps, there is a point at which a heavier bullet could be flatter than a lighter bullet, but, I haven't tested at 1,000 yards to see. My original statements were based on the above tests and a few others where we actually tried shots up to 600, but, I don't doubt the information you show.
Sometimes, I live in my narrow world of what I actually take afield and test and would seldom attempt any shot on even prairie dogs beyond the 600 mark. Regretably, that leads to some generalizations on my part that may be different at further ranges. I may have some time the summer to do some longer range testing.
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Pumpkinslinger
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PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2008 11:38 pm    Post subject: Re: New Varmint Gun Reply with quote

Grumulkin, just wondering... Do you use a .585 Nyati for whitetail? Wink

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Grumulkin
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PostPosted: Sat May 17, 2008 5:51 am    Post subject: Re: New Varmint Gun Reply with quote

Pumpkinslinger wrote:
Grumulkin, just wondering... Do you use a .585 Nyati for whitetail? Wink

I would if I had one.
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Pumpkinslinger
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PostPosted: Sat May 17, 2008 9:16 am    Post subject: Re: New Varmint Gun Reply with quote

Grumulkin, it would be kinda fun! Had any experience with the .375 Ruger yet? I've been looking at them, just for the heck of it.

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Grumulkin
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PostPosted: Sat May 17, 2008 11:10 am    Post subject: Re: New Varmint Gun Reply with quote

I've had no experience with the 375 Ruger but I'm thinking an Encore handgun chambered for that cartridge or perhaps for a 375 Weatherby Magnum would be interesting. In a handgun, the shorter 375 Ruger cartridge would give me a little extra barrel length.
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Pumpkinslinger
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PostPosted: Sat May 17, 2008 12:38 pm    Post subject: Re: New Varmint Gun Reply with quote

About all I can say to that is ... OUCH!

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Crackshot
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PostPosted: Sat May 17, 2008 4:44 pm    Post subject: Re: New Varmint Gun Reply with quote

Grumulkin? Are you over compensating for something? Very Happy I must be to then. Sad

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Dimitri
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PostPosted: Sat May 17, 2008 4:45 pm    Post subject: Re: New Varmint Gun Reply with quote

Nothing wrong with using alot of gun on game you do not plan on eating or using.

Dimitri

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Grumulkin
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PostPosted: Sat May 17, 2008 7:42 pm    Post subject: Re: New Varmint Gun Reply with quote

Actually, in a varmint gun, since the targets are small, accuracy is the number one priority. My 375 H&H Mag. will do 1 inch or less 3 shot groups at 100 yards.

If you choose the proper bullet, you can shoot a small animal with a big bore firearm and not have excessive meat or hide damage. Since I shot the above Jackal with an FMJ, damage to the hide wasn't excessive. It will be a full body mount in my office.
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Arizona Hunter
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PostPosted: Wed May 21, 2008 8:11 am    Post subject: Re: New Varmint Gun Reply with quote

I love my 204 for prairie dogs using 32 and 40 gr. V-Max bullets.

For coyotes my friend switched to the new Hornady 45 gr. Spire point for in his 204. He says the penetration is much much better beyond 200 yards than with a 40.
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