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Thoughts on abortion?
Discussions run-amok, innane banter it all goes here
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ElyBoy
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2008 11:17 am    Post subject: Re: Thoughts on abortion? Reply with quote

I'm a devout Catholic Dimitri, so you know were I stand on abortion.
I do think that the only way to drop the number of abortions, is to give the mother counseling before she does anything radical.
This is where the Government comes in and should make it easier for people to adopt.
I also believe that young, single mothers should be able to get assistance with day care, etc.
You just can't tell the mother to have the baby, and then leave her on her own.
Young mothers need help.
I do give Hillary Clinton credit on this.
She tried the best that she could on loosening red tape on adoptions.
The Republicans fought her tooth and nail on this, but at least she tried.

I agree with Dallan, Dimitri.
Abortion is a touchy subject.
Good people disagree on this.
I just think that changing the law, is not the answer.
Education is.
Pitt is correct. If people saw what an aborting really is, there would be no more of it.

Eric

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tracker
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2008 2:10 pm    Post subject: Re: Thoughts on abortion? Reply with quote

Dimitri wrote:
Was wondering on what your thoughts on abortion was? Seems to me is a hot button issue that comes up quite a bit.
Thoughts ?? :?Dimitri

I'm glad my Mom didn't have one, other than that I think I'll just walk away from the subject, it has nothing to do with hunting.

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1895ss
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2008 3:09 pm    Post subject: Re: Thoughts on abortion? Reply with quote

tracker wrote:

I'm glad my Mom didn't have one, other than that I think I'll just walk away from the subject, it has nothing to do with hunting.

I agree

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keetoowah
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 05, 2008 6:43 pm    Post subject: Re: Thoughts on abortion? Reply with quote

totally agreement with my mate. not a hunting issue.

all i can tell you is your views and some of your opinions will change becoming a parent. children bring things to the table you cant even think of yet.

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Handloader
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 05, 2008 7:30 pm    Post subject: Re: Thoughts on abortion? Reply with quote

It may not be hunting related, however, much of our banter in Spam-O-Rama falls into that catagory. The subject of abortion makes some uneasy and, as pointed out, it is a divisive issue.

IMO there should be broad based national discussion on the matter and it should be resolved, at least on the legal aspect. Those opposing often state that the fetus has the Constitutional guarantees and those favoring abortion don't recognize life until birth. IOW, there needs to be a national decision regarding the point at which life begins. Whether that decision is at the point of conception, the second trimester or upon delivery, it is an important matter of definition. I favor such discussions.

Roe v Wade may be overturned with the composition of today's Supreme Court. If so, that would be an opportune time to engage the discussion of "when does life begin" hence when do the guarantees and penalties for abrogation of the definition start.

Much like the current DC v Heller case that will help to refine the definition of 2nd Ammendment, challenges to Roe v Wade will catapult the subject to a national level. I believe both issues should be addressed and resolved, at least from the point of "right to life" chronology.
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Dimitri
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 05, 2008 7:35 pm    Post subject: Re: Thoughts on abortion? Reply with quote

Handloader,

You got valid points, except I don't think that kind of call will ever be made at the Canadian Surpreme court.

Dimitri

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Bushmaster
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 06, 2008 7:33 am    Post subject: Re: Thoughts on abortion? Reply with quote

Abortion...I believe that if the mother to be is in danger of her life by the fetes she can opt to have one. If it was caused by rape and is a real mental problem for her (and it will be) she can opt to have one. If the mother is on welfare she shouldn't even be playing around in the first place. Should she have an abortion? For some of the more permiscuous, poor or uneducated) it's a form of birth control. and in a lot of cases the tax payer foots the bill.

With all the ways we have to keep from becoming pregnent abortion shouldn't even be an issue.

Except for the two reasons listed above I'm a against abortion, but it's not really my business as I'm not the one that's pregnent. Nor do I, or have I ever been in that position to have to make that desision.

My biggest complaint is the woman that gets one abortion after another because she is to dumb or lazy to protect against getting pregnent in the first place. Or a man that doesn't take proper measures to help the woman not get pregnent...It's both's responcibilty....Before and after...

The government shouldn't even be in the mix...

I'm impressed...Well discussed and no lost tempers...Good job people...

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ElyBoy
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 06, 2008 8:27 am    Post subject: Re: Thoughts on abortion? Reply with quote

It's the type of quality folks we have around here Bushy.

This is this only place that I would even think to put my two cents worth about abortion without expecting an all our donybrook.

Eric

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OntheLasGallinas
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 06, 2008 11:44 am    Post subject: Re: Thoughts on abortion? Reply with quote

Abortion is a touchy subject, that's for sure. I just don't think the tax payer should foot the bill for any individuals personal choice.

Cary

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vint2
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 06, 2008 3:09 pm    Post subject: Re: Thoughts on abortion? Reply with quote

I have to say that I am staunchly anti-abortion and pro-life!

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Dimitri
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 06, 2008 3:42 pm    Post subject: Re: Thoughts on abortion? Reply with quote

I agree with Bushmaster, there are many ways out there to prevent pregnancy. Both knowing that at 14-17 you shouldn't be sleeping around, and a whole isle of birth control items at the drug store today, where no one will "judge" you for buying a box of condoms. When in the past it wasn't the case.

When I went to highschool most of the girls, even the girls that were not sleeping (or never slept around for that matter) around were on the pill, it was a means for most of them to control their periods with the added bonus of getting rid of "that time of the month".

Thats why myself I do not agree when pro-choice people decide to say something to the effect that it's a valid means of birth control. Its like Quality control at a factory, its meant to make sure the parts the customer gets are right before they get to the buyer, its not a means of fixing mistakes after they went too far (ie the bad parts getting to the customer).

As for Bushmasters comment on if the girl got raped or complications in the pregnancy will result in the women dieing, he makes valid points, I didn't really too much think of that myself. But both do happen.

Dimitri

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vint2
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 06, 2008 3:57 pm    Post subject: Re: Thoughts on abortion? Reply with quote

The baby has as much of a right to live as the mother, and that ends my comments on this issue.

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Morax
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 06, 2008 8:31 pm    Post subject: Re: Thoughts on abortion? Reply with quote

i was wondering when this was going to turn to monies and who pays for what... lets remove all the garbage behind it all and get to one problem at a time on it...

the question posed wasnt who pays for what

this will really sound bad, and i hope folks see the hidden humor in this statement but, why dont it just be "prorated" you know if the critter is from x old to x old it costs this much...


personal experiance here, the ex mulled it over when our daughter was being formed and i dont wanna do that roller coaster ride again..

some MEN and yeah i capitolized it for a reason, they stand up take responcability, want the child from the very begining, why do they have to go to court to fight for thier rights as a father, whereas the mother is granted undeniably these rights...
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hunterjoe21
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2008 6:24 pm    Post subject: Re: Thoughts on abortion? Reply with quote

Dimitri wrote:
I agree with Bushmaster, there are many ways out there to prevent pregnancy. Both knowing that at 14-17 you shouldn't be sleeping around, and a whole isle of birth control items at the drug store today, where no one will "judge" you for buying a box of condoms. When in the past it wasn't the case.

When I went to highschool most of the girls, even the girls that were not sleeping (or never slept around for that matter) around were on the pill, it was a means for most of them to control their periods with the added bonus of getting rid of "that time of the month".

Thats why myself I do not agree when pro-choice people decide to say something to the effect that it's a valid means of birth control. Its like Quality control at a factory, its meant to make sure the parts the customer gets are right before they get to the buyer, its not a means of fixing mistakes after they went too far (ie the bad parts getting to the customer).

As for Bushmasters comment on if the girl got raped or complications in the pregnancy will result in the women dieing, he makes valid points, I didn't really too much think of that myself. But both do happen.

Dimitri

I've never heard it referred to as birth control. I can see how it would be objectionable in that context.

I still maintain that legislating morality is impossible. Unless (As handloader stated) there is a clear definition of the beginning of life, every opinion will remain just that, an opinion.

And thank God I'll never need to make that decision.

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Dimitri
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2008 6:29 pm    Post subject: Re: Thoughts on abortion? Reply with quote

Joe,

I just typed in "Pro-Abortion" and on the first hit has a definition of:

Quote::
Pro-abortion is the belief in the right to choose to terminate a fetus (fertilized embryo). Pro-abortion is also a movement, which fights for the rights of women to have a choice to end unwanted pregnancies.

Which seems to be a common theme, "to end a unwanted pregnancy" which makes it a form of birth control in my opinion. As its a mean to stop having a child you didn't want which is what birth control is for.

Dimitri

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