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Fire Forming Brass
Discussion regarding the reloading of ammunition and tuning of loads for accuracy
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bodyalter
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Location: Central Minnesota

PostPosted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 10:20 pm    Post subject: Fire Forming Brass Reply with quote

hello all!! This is my first post to this Forum so I thought I would throw somthing a little diffrent at ya all. My question is this, Does it matter what powder and weight of bullet I use to fire form a wildcat cartridge? I have a custom 7mm TC/U that was handed down to me from my father, and his notes show he used 14.5 gr of 2400 and a 169 gr hdy bthp. Sense I do not have much for 2400, very fet 169 gr bullets, and over 100 cases to fire form I wanted to know if a 15% reduced charge from the reloading data and a 120 gr bullet would do the work I needed.

now I know that there are those people who will tell me to use a few grs of Bullseye or Unique, some cream of wheat and some tissue, but this is a piece of art that I would be fireing it through and I just can't make myself do it. So any advice would be welcome.



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Bushmaster
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 10:45 pm    Post subject: Re: Fire Forming Brass Reply with quote

Light to medium weight bullet and a light powder charge...Within load manual specifications...

And welcome to this sight...Grab a beer, sit a spell, Join in and enjoy...

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bodyalter
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 11:15 pm    Post subject: Re: Fire Forming Brass Reply with quote

Thanks for the quick reply. I'm a person who realy gets into a hobby. Reloading is becoming a religion to me. I wake up, make my coffee, and as I'm having my first smoke of the day, I think about load data, if I should load up the last of my brass or wait for a colder day(to night it was 29f on my way home from work(almost a heat wave)). And when I am unable to get to a range and use up all my ammo, I start iching to buy more brass. OK so I am way off my subject now. light to med bullet weight, light powder charge. Thanks again

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1895ss
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 2:12 am    Post subject: Re: Fire Forming Brass Reply with quote

Like Bushy says, don't load less then minimum specs ........ Smile

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PaulS
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 2:22 am    Post subject: Re: Fire Forming Brass Reply with quote

Never try to guess what a load should be - always consult at least two manuals. That will keep your body and soul together and your guns too.

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Speer, Lyman, Hodgdon, Sierra, and Hornady = reliable loading data
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Always check data against manuals
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4rum
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 6:27 am    Post subject: Re: Fire Forming Brass Reply with quote

Good rule of thumb also... When the 'loadin' light is on... the smokin' light is off.

Wives seem to have little understanding when you lose your wedding band, finger, hand, arm... uh.... well you get my drift.

Be careful, load a lot, shoot often.

Oh yeah, WELCOME!
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skb2706
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 9:38 am    Post subject: Re: Fire Forming Brass Reply with quote

TC Contenders are notorious for shooting 'fire form loads' very well ( I could and would hunt with many of mine). If it were me I wouldn't try to load down for forming purposes. I would work up loads as you would any other gun all the while making formed cases.
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Bushmaster
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 9:47 am    Post subject: Re: Fire Forming Brass Reply with quote

I believe bodyalter is trying to fire form cases that are not quite the same as his wild cat chamber. Another words cases that he has produced from other cases to fit his wild cat chamber. If this is true...Then what I said comes from the books. At least that's how I read his post. If he is fire forming what already fits his chambers then skb2706 is correct...

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bodyalter
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 10:05 am    Post subject: Re: Fire Forming Brass Reply with quote

What I am fire forming are resized Win 223 rem brass. I have right near 400 mill 223 brass that have been in the family sense before I was born, and I'm starting to get loose primer pockets, signs of case seperation, and split necks. so its time to retire them.

That being said, I'm gona go with what bushmaster said and use 120 grn hdy hp (I have about 1000 of um) and a light load of h4895 (Haveing more of this powder than any other) and cci200 primers. Thanks for everyones input though.

I do beleave in safety first, my father having a 45/70 gov blow up due to a double charged case about 16 years ago. The fault of that one was a scale that required way too much TLC and measured off by up to 30 gr if you didn't do the little dance with it.

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SwampFox
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 3:31 pm    Post subject: Re: Fire Forming Brass Reply with quote

Body,
Actually the 7TCU will shoot just about any bullet and powder combination you can put into it. However, it is best to fire form the brass with a heavy load, not a light load. Actually you should fire form with the load you are going to use in regular shooting. I fire form my brass with my regular match loads. Also, do yourself a favor, buy some commercial 223 brass and make your 7TCU brass from commercial. Military brass in 223 is not consistant, not even in the placement of the flash hole. The 7TCU shoots fire forming brass just the same as formed brass.

In cast:
145 RCBS over 15 grains of H-4227
145 RCBS over 17.5 grains of RL 7
168 RCBS over 6.5 grains of Unique
168 RCBS over 25 grains H-4895
168 RCBS over 23 grains 2015 BR

In jacketed:
130 Speer over 29 grains 748
160 speer over 28 grains 748

If the gun you have is in your avitar, it is an old action (based on the 600) XP-100 in a cenergrip wood stock. It looks to be a steel gun, set up for silhouette matches, with a scope. The XPs are some of the finest long distance handguns ever built and .25 inch groups from an XP are not unusual. I am down to my last two 7TCU guns from a high of 8.... they are just a pleasure to shoot and own, take care of yours and it will last a lifetime. Your dad obviously thought a lot of that XP, to pass it on.

Best of luck,
Ed

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bodyalter
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Joined: Jan 10, 2007
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Location: Central Minnesota

PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 11:45 pm    Post subject: Re: Fire Forming Brass Reply with quote

well it does look like a XP but it is a Sako Action he won in a silhouette match. It is custom from the bottom up. Form fitted grip, fortunately not much diffrent from my own. It is a True pleasure to shoot. just wish I had a hunting stock set up for it.

Thank you Swamp for the fire forming advice. I have pretty much decided to shoot what I have loaded up and then switch to commercial brass. A lot of the Forums I've read praise Winchester brass, so thats what my first lot of new stuff is. I'll let you know how it comes out next week. monday - thursday will be my days of blasting. Even though the forcast shows a high temp of 7 degrees f and a low of -6. just have to make sure the range heater is on.

Matt

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bodyalter
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2007 9:58 am    Post subject: Re: Fire Forming Brass Reply with quote

in reading these posts again I'm forced to wonder how the heck did I get large primers in that 223 brass? special primeing tool? sooo oops typo CCI400 primers...

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sniper
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Location: Utah

PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 8:39 pm    Post subject: Re: Fire Forming Brass Reply with quote

[quote="bodyalter"]What I am fire forming are resized Win 223 rem brass. I have right near 400 mill 223 brass that have been in the family sense before I was born, and I'm starting to get loose primer pockets, signs of case seperation, and split necks. so its time to retire them./quote]

Yup, sounds like some new brass is about due, if only "just because"! Your gun will thank you! Laughing

If you are looking for a powder that is really forgiving, and will do a good job in reduced loads, as well as full power, take a visit to Hodgdon's web site, and read their info on H4895. I was impressed!
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bodyalter
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Location: Central Minnesota

PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 10:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Fire Forming Brass Reply with quote

I'm useing h4895, imr 4895, h322, and RL7 in my curent batch of ammo trying to find a load that will group well

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