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When It doesn't Feel Right.............
Discussion regarding the reloading of ammunition and tuning of loads for accuracy
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dhc4ever
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 5:52 pm    Post subject: Re: When It doesn't Feel Right............. Reply with quote

MacD wrote:
Is there some reason not to reuse the powder?

It having been wet may cause a change in burn rate.
How much I dont know, at the least it will clump into bigger bits.
The old English navy found that the burn rate on black powder increased dramatically if the powder was wet and then dried out.
As much as I hate to rate Mythbusters as a source of scientific fact they did a very good demo on the burn rate differences, the wet then dried powder was something like 5 x faster than the dry non wet powder.
Nitrocellulose is different but why take the chance?

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jcruthis
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 7:38 pm    Post subject: Re: When It doesn't Feel Right............. Reply with quote

i was with mac in wondering why...i just figured you threw it out out of aggravation..lol.. seems you guys have yet again taught me something new, thanks DHC
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Elvis
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 10:51 pm    Post subject: Re: When It doesn't Feel Right............. Reply with quote

Im pleased someone else asked.
personally I would reuse it if its good enough going in in should be good enough still I would have thought. plenty of people pull rounds to reuse the components.

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Fireman_DJ
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 12:42 am    Post subject: Re: When It doesn't Feel Right............. Reply with quote

If I know the components ARE good, I'll reuse them. But if anything is unknown (like what primer or powder is used) those components get recycled for non-ammo uses.

If I'm pulling because of misfires, everything but the metal gets recycled for non-ammo uses.

It's not just the potential risk of injury or damage, it's the risk of inaccuracy of the rounds when I'm spending thousands of dollars trying to get the best out of my rifle.
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Vince
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 3:35 am    Post subject: Re: When It doesn't Feel Right............. Reply with quote

AMEN DJ...I agree totally mate.

If you are seeking perfection, using a component that you feel is less than perfect is a compromise at best.

Look at how many of us check our components, measure and weigh cases, ensure flash holes are exact, necks are measured and trimmed for precise and consistent grip of the projectile...check projectiles, weigh them, measure the dimensions and group projectiles of like size and weight, then carefully seat them to a precise distance off the lands...and all of this more often than not for hunting rounds. If I am not mistaken, DJFireman either shoots Bench Rest of 1000 yard target shooting...both of which demand precise, as close to perfect rounds as possible.

I am happy to recycle components, but then again I and a tight ars3...so long as I know them to be OK. The chance of water getting into a loaded round (unless submerged for some time) is fairly remote, so I will look at the powder and make a decision on it's viability. Having said that, I have never encountered this problem, but if recovered powder is obviously clumping because of moisture...out it goes, otherwise it goes into a clearly marked separate container (if there is a fair quantity of it) for future use. If it is only one or two rounds, the powder goes back into the container it came from, which is given a good shake to mix it well so any difference is pretty much negated.

Cheers, Vince

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Fireman_DJ
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 6:06 am    Post subject: Re: When It doesn't Feel Right............. Reply with quote

You can just call me DJ.

And it's F/Class shooting in the F/TR class shooting up to 1000 yards with a .308.

My current rifle is a Rem700 Varmint with Wilddog tactical stock, Niko Sterling 10-50x60 scope and Harris bi-pod. Coming soon is a new trigger (Rifle Basix), a new sling (Tactical Interventions Slip Cuff detachable) and a new scope (Nightforce 5.5-22x56 NXS).

And thinking of building a new rifle for long range "fun (the calibre will exceed the max allowed for F/Class). Maybe a .375 Cheytac.
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Elvis
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 4:18 pm    Post subject: Re: When It doesn't Feel Right............. Reply with quote

sounds like a good bunny gun.

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ElyBoy
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 7:10 pm    Post subject: Re: When It doesn't Feel Right............. Reply with quote

I just started reloading for my AR.
I have never loaded .223 and picked up a set of Lee dies.
I have used Lee dies on pistol but never on rifle cartridges.
Right off the bat my brass got stuck in the sizing die.
Fixed that one up, and my next one got stuck.

On this, I have a bad feeling about the Lee die on rifle loads, and to top that off, I'm new to reloading .223.
I figure on tossing these Lee dies and getting a good set of Redding.

For me, better safe than sorry, and I'll take the loss of $30.00 to a sorry learning experience.

Just like you guys say, if you have a bad feeling, don't proceed.

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Elvis
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 7:38 pm    Post subject: Re: When It doesn't Feel Right............. Reply with quote

I load .223 all the time. check you have the dies set up correctly ,most reloading manuals will tell you how, and make sure the lubing process is done corectly. that said check your brass out carefully as I use GI brass as I was given a sack full and some is great but the other type has loose primer pockets and will grab in the dies (I have redding that I was given) some of the brass has wierd extraction marks probly from being extracted under full auto conditions. also give the new dies a good clean there maybe some crap on the inside from sitting around on the shelf.
hope that helps.

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Fireman_DJ
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 25, 2012 2:41 am    Post subject: Re: When It doesn't Feel Right............. Reply with quote

I shoot F/Class with it, but that's not all I do with it.
It has been used for hunting (and will again in the future).
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MacD
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 25, 2012 11:18 am    Post subject: Re: When It doesn't Feel Right............. Reply with quote

I have Lee dies both full and neck sizing. I have never had any problems with the dies only with the guy attached to the press handle. (That would be me.)
Follow the instructions for setting up and lube the brass including the inside of the neck. I also polished the inside of the dies using a light abrasive metal polish, flitz.

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Suzanne
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 25, 2012 12:06 pm    Post subject: Re: When It doesn't Feel Right............. Reply with quote

Elyboy I have six sets of Lee rifle dies, no problems. I bet your lube procedures need looking into. You have to get the inside neck lubed and the outside, but not the shoulder area. The pistol dies are carbide and don't need to be lubed and maybe that's what you're used to, but the rifle dies have to be.

Suz

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Ominivision1
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 25, 2012 1:11 pm    Post subject: Re: When It doesn't Feel Right............. Reply with quote

ElyBoy

I use a smidgen of graphite powder to lube the insides of case necks, I have a small container of kiwi shoe polish that holds the graphite powder and dip the case ever so little into the graphite. Pencils also work great to wipe the inside of the neck also since the "lead" is graphite.

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ElyBoy
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 25, 2012 9:46 pm    Post subject: Re: When It doesn't Feel Right............. Reply with quote

I tried the powder on the necks with no change.
Then, just for giggles, I sprayed some RemOil on the case, and it worked just fine. Smooth as silk.
Then, with the confidence that only comes with 40 years of reloading Bonk I saturated a case with my Hornady One Shot and promptly got the case stuck again Stupid

Actually, this is kind of fun. Too many years trying out new loads, and everything going too smooth.

Now I have to figure if this is my fault, which is quite possible seeing that along with all of my pistols and a multitude of high powered rifles, I have never reloaded a light caliber round like the .223, or is it the die.

The one thing that does stick out, and I will ask all of you this, is that spraying on the RemOil everything worked just fine, but with the One Shot it got stuck again.
This shows a very tight tolerance in the full length resizing die to me.

Any thoughts would help, because Judy is going in for a 3 hour Pet Test in the morning, and only 2 miles of highway separates the waiting room and a fine gun shop with some Redding dies.

One thing that I haven't mentioned is that I am sizing once fired just tumbled Federal brass.

Eric

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dhc4ever
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 25, 2012 10:10 pm    Post subject: Re: When It doesn't Feel Right............. Reply with quote

Elyboy,
as the others have mentioned, have another look at your setup and lubrication process. That it didnt get stuck with Rem oil is a subtle hint.
I'd also pull it apart and have an optic at the insides to see if there are any rough bits or burrs.
As you're going to the gunshop, pickup some Imperial sizing die wax, best lube (for reloading) I've used, a little bit goes a very long way.
If your still having problems give Lee a call and see what they are prepared to do.
Good luck to your wife for the PET scan, I hope all goes well and they find nothing.

Cheers

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